Power differences 1250, 1450, 1650?

[drglinski]

Dad's 12 HP in his 125 was great till I moved out and bought a 14 HP 147-- makes the 12 HP look tiny. Never used a 16 HP but I bet that one is even better. Dad said they really thump.

[Bill410]

Oldskull, I was actually thinking of the OTHER side of that.....

True, a tired k341 would make more hp than a TIRED 301. But couldn't you also say that a "lightly built" 301 would make more power than a tired (or even average) 341?

There is extra power to be made by cleaning up the intake track/valves, improving breathing in and out, mildly increasing compression, cam, etc..... All the stuff that the pulling guys routinely do. Pretty easy and relatively cheap stuff that could make a few extra ponies without affecting real world reliability and drivability.

If you could get the 341's power out of the 301 without the extra displacement's vibration, wouldn't that be a win/win?

I DO understand what you were saying about a tired engine. My deere 110 was pretty tired when I got it - to the point that it could only cut grass at the slowest speeds. Was a BIG difference when I finally rebuilt the motor!

If you are already rebuilding a tired engine, it isn't a huge additional expense to improve efficiency.

Of course, I guess you could also pay to have the 14/16hp engine's rotating assemblies balanced (NOT balance gears!). So you would Still get the power with less vibration. More than one way to get it done I guess!

[john hall]

Originally Posted by Bill410

Thanks everyone so far for your responses!

I cut my grass now with a gear drive deere 110 - 8 hp kohler and a 38" deck, and it seems to cut pretty high grass without any trouble. I know the hydro on the cubs uses a little more power than a gear drive, so "less" is available for the mower/pto. And not sure how "efficient" the cub decks are compared to green. But + 4 hp and 6" wider deck, not sure how it would come out.

I'm getting too lazy to shift gears, and the 110 turns like a truck, so bought the cub to replace it as my main grass cutter. Then came across the 1650, so now trying to decide who gets the grass cutting honors!

I grew up using a 110 Deere with 8hp Kohler. Lets just say that is a fabulous machine. I believe in the saying iron sharpens iron---Good competition from Deere forced Cadet to build the quality of machine we all love from Cadet.--By the way, I think the steering gearbox on that machine is the same as the older Cadets. When you get your Cadet fixed there are quite a few good steering box rebuild threads on this site.

I'm with everyone else, 12hp is fine for cutting grass. We've got a 128 (gear drive). Unless the grass is too tall, that's more engine than it needs for cutting grass. If it were a hydro, I could push it a little harder to take advantage of the unused HP.

FWIW, the IH dealer my dad worked for sold very few 14 and 16 hp machines. Pretty much because 12hp would mow fine and most folks around here used small IH tractors for gardening. And should it snow we declare a 2 day holiday and watch it melt.

[OldSkull]

Originally Posted by Bill410

Oldskull, I was actually thinking of the OTHER side of that.....

True, a tired k341 would make more hp than a TIRED 301. But couldn't you also say that a "lightly built" 301 would make more power than a tired (or even average) 341?

There is extra power to be made by cleaning up the intake track/valves, improving breathing in and out, mildly increasing compression, cam, etc..... All the stuff that the pulling guys routinely do. Pretty easy and relatively cheap stuff that could make a few extra ponies without affecting real world reliability and drivability.

If you could get the 341's power out of the 301 without the extra displacement's vibration, wouldn't that be a win/win?

I DO understand what you were saying about a tired engine. My deere 110 was pretty tired when I got it - to the point that it could only cut grass at the slowest speeds. Was a BIG difference when I finally rebuilt the motor!

If you are already rebuilding a tired engine, it isn't a huge additional expense to improve efficiency.

Of course, I guess you could also pay to have the 14/16hp engine's rotating assemblies balanced (NOT balance gears!). So you would Still get the power with less vibration. More than one way to get it done I guess!

I agree with you 200% there is more then one way to resolve a power issue and yes a freshly well rebuilt K301 can outperform a tired K341. The advantage of a more powerful K series engine is you can wait a bit longer before performing a TBO and wen you did refresh them you notice the difference in torque the bigger "jug" got.

The hydro tranny eat few pony's compare to a manual tranny, every extra one you can get are welcome for an hydraulics system.