Creeper system....

[darkminion_17]

Do you have any pics of your rear PTO?

[garnold]

No, kind of wanted to learn more about this here.

[157bradley]

The oil in a splash lube engine will be flying around nearly as much at idle as full throttle. A larger concern would be engine cooling at lower RPMs, but for light loads you could reduce the engine speed somewhat and not harm anything.

I can't imagine why you'd want to go slower than first gear while plowing...1st is pretty slow to begin with, and the plow turns the dirt over much better in 2nd gear.

You can always get a hydro-transmission Cub

I have some factory service manuals here from Kohler, Briggs and Tecumseh that would disagree with your statement about low rpm oiling. Non-pressurized motors are not designed for extended periods of idling or low rpm use under load. They will die a slow death from lack of proper upper end lubing.

I agree with you about the temperature being an issue. That is why I installed a low amp draw fan (intended for boat bilge areas) and a temperature gauge on my 100. It gets over 100 here in the summer sometimes so every air cooled engine needs help.

Yes I realize that when soil has the proper moisture content that plowing in second gear can be done. I use my garden tractors a lot with a box blade to maintain a long dirt and gravel driveway. First gear at near full throttle is WAY too fast for this on a 100. You will bend or break something.

According to factory manuals the ground speed on my 100 (and my 102 for that matter) is 2.3 mph in first gear.

That is too fast for several of my attachments: Box Blade, Ripper, Middle Buster and my pull behind Tiller (a tow behind with it's own engine). It is fine for my Cultivator, Sweeper, Disc and Section Harrows.

I have two "off topic" garden tractors that came from the factory with granny first gears with minimum speeds of .3 mph and .6 mph respectively.

Thousands of these models of "off topic" tractors were built and are still in use so I am clearly not in the minority for thinking that granny gears are useful. It is a shame that I have to use something that isn't yellow and white to get what I need.

I know I could use a Hydro. I also own a 107, but I don't enjoy it nearly as much as my 100.

Brad

[Matt G.]

Originally Posted by 157bradley

I have some factory service manuals here from Kohler, Briggs and Tecumseh that would disagree with your statement about low rpm oiling.

That's what I used to think too...there's an engineer on another one of the Cub Cadet forums that used to work at Tecumseh, I think, and he explained that they had put windows in an engine block on a splash-lube engine. The oil was getting flung everywhere regardless of engine speed.

Show me where in the K-series owner's manual there are any cautions about lack of lubrication at idle.

I also never said to run it under load at idle...not less than half throttle would be fine for short periods.

I think you're overly concerned about breaking something. I've used a grader blade in first gear on a hard, dry gravel driveway with no issues (on a tractor with nearly twice the horsepower of your 100, too), plowed a rock-hard no-till field in second gear with several different tractors, and done many other things like that with no issues. The key to avoiding damage is to not have so much weight that the wheels can't lose traction. If the wheels can slip when the load suddenly increases, this will protect the tractor from damage.

[garnold]

Maybe if I explained my actual need I could better get the direction I need. This 108 is more of a family member and I plan to use it strictly for fun. Each year we have a Halloween party and next year I want to have a hay ride featuring my 108 This guy is going to need to pull some kids around the property in a nice trailer. I just thought the creeper would be a good idea. I do also plan to plow snow with it at some point but that is a few years out. This is all about the memories folks and having my daughter's remember their goofy dad pulling them around in his tractor each year.

[ol'George]

Originally Posted by Matt G.

That's what I used to think too...there's an engineer on another one of the Cub Cadet forums that used to work at Tecumseh, I think, and he explained that they had put windows in an engine block on a splash-lube engine. The oil was getting flung everywhere regardless of engine speed.

Show me where in the K-series owner's manual there are any cautions about lack of lubrication at idle.

I also never said to run it under load at idle...not less than half throttle would be fine for short periods.

I think you're overly concerned about breaking something. I've used a grader blade in first gear on a hard, dry gravel driveway with no issues (on a tractor with nearly twice the horsepower of your 100, too), plowed a rock-hard no-till field in second gear with several different tractors, and done many other things like that with no issues. The key to avoiding damage is to not have so much weight that the wheels can't lose traction. If the wheels can slip when the load suddenly increases, this will protect the tractor from damage.

I agree with Matt,(pretty smart for a "kid") Ha,LOL! it has always been my feeling that the greater amount of damage/wear occurs @ start up when not only is the oil cold, but there is little lube if any, left on surfaces like the piston/wall.
Just pull a dipstick on a cold engine and picture the "honey" trying to splash in areas that need to be lubed.
It is a wonder engines last as long as they do.
I have heard many times where folks start an engine up cold, and rev it.
---To me, that is like dragging your arm in gravel with something heavy sitting on it,
---not a pretty picture Ha,LOL!

[PaulS]

Just a few things for the totally uniniated to a creeper gear. I have a creeper in my 102. A creeper will give you a 6 speed tractor. With the tractor in low creeper you will have three speeds although you cannot change gears with the creeper in low you must switch to high and change gears and then back to low. First gear low is very very slow while third gear low is slightly less ground speed than high 1st gear. About the only time I actually need or use the creeper is when I am blowing snow and then I am shifting into high to back up. My only troubles with the creeper gear are the roll pin in the drive shaft has sheared off and the roll pin that connects the lever inside the creeper has come out a couple times. I do own an off brand tractor that has a granny gear but seldom use it as it is my wood hauler and occasional mower.

[Matt G.]

Originally Posted by PaulS

you cannot change gears with the creeper in low you must switch to high and change gears and then back to low.

Not sure where you heard that, but it's wrong.

[157bradley]

Matt,

Your replies are blunt and argumentative.

I thought this forum was to encourage people to buy, restore, love and use Cub Cadets.

Look at the number of folks in this thread with less than 100 posts.

Do you think you are making them (us) feel welcome by your confrontational replies?

I want my Cub to go slower in first gear. All you have done is tell me why I really don't want that and I don't know how to use my equipment.

Thanks for the welcome.

[Mike McKown]

Originally Posted by Matt G.

The tiller is doing all of the work, and the tractor is holding the tiller back. There is little load on the driveline while tilling, or throwing snow, for that matter.

Ever seen the inside of one before? There are several parts in there that aren't particularly beefy.



)

In my experience with using the Cub tiller, you're right the tiller does the work of pushing the the tractor. It also yanks the tractor back and forth when the ground is hard. That snatchin'/grabbin' is a lot harder on the driveline than a steady, hard pull. The jerking is how you break things. If the creeper gear has wear problems, I'm not aware of it.

Yes, I've seen the inside of several. I own two of them. Never had any problem except breaking the pin in the driveshaft coupling.