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  #141  
Old 03-21-2021, 11:44 PM
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sawdustdad sawdustdad is offline
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Definitely a right hand or clockwise valve plate in your hydro. Holding the plate in your hand, so you can see the wear surface, the “fish is swimming” clockwise. In this case the pump is driven from the back, so looking at it from the axle end it is turning clockwise. The pump doesn’t care which end you drive it from as long as the plate matches the rotation.

If you want to turn the hydro the opposite rotation, you’ll need a left hand plate.

But this does show that you’re slowly talking yourself into another unique project!
Here's what the plates look like. This is actually a different hydro, one I repaired in 2013, but should be identical. Clearly, I was confused, the "fish" are swimming clockwise. Not sure what I was thinking.
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  #142  
Old 03-21-2021, 11:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Ambush View Post
Definitely a right hand or clockwise valve plate in your hydro. Holding the plate in your hand, so you can see the wear surface, the “fish is swimming” clockwise. In this case the pump is driven from the back, so looking at it from the axle end it is turning clockwise. The pump doesn’t care which end you drive it from as long as the plate matches the rotation.

If you want to turn the hydro the opposite rotation, you’ll need a left hand plate.

But this does show that you’re slowly talking yourself into another unique project!
Ambush, what would happen if I ground notches on the other "fish" so the pump plate looked like the motor plate? Four notches? Or used another hydro's motor plate?
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  #143  
Old 03-22-2021, 12:39 AM
Ambush Ambush is offline
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The pump would by pass from pressure side to "suction" side and overheat. Plus noise and very poor performance. The notches are there for pressure relief at the end of each piston's pressure cycle. If it were possible to have pump plates notched on both sides, manufacturers would do it to save inventory costs. It may exist, but I don't recall ever seeing any.

Left hand plates should be available, but to find a dealer that would bother to find one is the problem. This same pump size and series is used in Sundstrand pumps for many close loop systems, not just hydro's. If I had one in pieces, I could likely get it matched to a series. Might find that info on Google to. I'll search around a bit tomorrow.

If you google Sundstrand 15 series, you'll see examples of the the hydro units and closed loop but separate pump/motors transmissions. Same parts in a different package. These hydro's were used in a lot of smaller equipment like sweepers, airport equipment, swathers and the like.
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  #144  
Old 03-22-2021, 08:05 PM
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The pump would by pass from pressure side to "suction" side and overheat. Plus noise and very poor performance. The notches are there for pressure relief at the end of each piston's pressure cycle. If it were possible to have pump plates notched on both sides, manufacturers would do it to save inventory costs. It may exist, but I don't recall ever seeing any.

Left hand plates should be available, but to find a dealer that would bother to find one is the problem. This same pump size and series is used in Sundstrand pumps for many close loop systems, not just hydro's. If I had one in pieces, I could likely get it matched to a series. Might find that info on Google to. I'll search around a bit tomorrow.

If you google Sundstrand 15 series, you'll see examples of the the hydro units and closed loop but separate pump/motors transmissions. Same parts in a different package. These hydro's were used in a lot of smaller equipment like sweepers, airport equipment, swathers and the like.
Thank you, that is interesting and helpful. Might be easier to just swap the ring gear in the rear end.
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  #145  
Old 03-22-2021, 08:48 PM
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I think one of your major engineering puzzles might be being able to keep tension in your tracks. Some how your axles will have to adjust away from each other and still be driven by a common shaft. Track machines power from the same end, whereas yours will be slack on top on one side and slack on the bottom in the other.
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  #146  
Old 03-22-2021, 09:08 PM
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I think one of your major engineering puzzles might be being able to keep tension in your tracks. Some how your axles will have to adjust away from each other and still be driven by a common shaft. Track machines power from the same end, whereas yours will be slack on top on one side and slack on the bottom in the other.
To keep tension without having either axles sprung, what you could do is add a few spring-loaded idlers to support the top half of the track, perhaps they would be able to keep tension on the tracks?
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  #147  
Old 03-22-2021, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Ambush View Post
I think one of your major engineering puzzles might be being able to keep tension in your tracks. Some how your axles will have to adjust away from each other and still be driven by a common shaft. Track machines power from the same end, whereas yours will be slack on top on one side and slack on the bottom in the other.
I'm thinking a triangular track profile with a tensioner at the peak, not at the two ends.
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  #148  
Old 03-22-2021, 11:04 PM
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A mini Hi-Drive! That would be cool.
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  #149  
Old 03-22-2021, 11:08 PM
DRohacek DRohacek is offline
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Thank you, that is interesting and helpful. Might be easier to just swap the ring gear in the rear end.
Unfortunately swapping the ring gear will not change the fact that the pump is turning the opposite direction. Years ago I built a Cub with a 3.1 Buick engine driving it. As I did my research about turning the charge pump 180 degrees I now remember also reading about others that had done so. The (fish swim) is an interesting way to describe it. Anyway, the article I was reading basically said that it wouldn't hurt anything to run it this was but, what you will experience is as you move the travel lever from neutral it will not be smooth as the factory intended. The reason the plate is chamfered is for a smooth engagement as the fluid is directed that way. What I experienced was somewhat of a lurch as I engaged forward. I didn't think it was a big deal since I was powering it with a V6 car engine anyway.

Something that comes to mind though is you could swap the ring gear to change the travel but to cure the direction of the input issue you could consider a jack shaft from the rear drive shaft up the the front rear. That way the pump would be turning the proper direction.
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  #150  
Old 03-22-2021, 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by DRohacek View Post
Unfortunately swapping the ring gear will not change the fact that the pump is turning the opposite direction. Years ago I built a Cub with a 3.1 Buick engine driving it. As I did my research about turning the charge pump 180 degrees I now remember also reading about others that had done so. The (fish swim) is an interesting way to describe it. Anyway, the article I was reading basically said that it wouldn't hurt anything to run it this was but, what you will experience is as you move the travel lever from neutral it will not be smooth as the factory intended. The reason the plate is chamfered is for a smooth engagement as the fluid is directed that way. What I experienced was somewhat of a lurch as I engaged forward. I didn't think it was a big deal since I was powering it with a V6 car engine anyway.

Something that comes to mind though is you could swap the ring gear to change the travel but to cure the direction of the input issue you could consider a jack shaft from the rear drive shaft up the the front rear. That way the pump would be turning the proper direction.
I'll drive both hydrostats correctly--one from the "front" CCW, one from the rear, CW. First, turn the engine around, the forward axle will have rear differential cover facing forward, the rear axle will have the differential cover facing the engine. Still be trying to turn two hydros to start the engine unless I do as you suggest and raise the engine up and use belts again....Maybe I'll put a gear drive Cub clutch in it.

I'm going to start another thread on mini-dozer build. Let's take this discussion over there.
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