My new...... super?

[jimbob200521]

Great looking acquisition! I can't wait till you get it going. Hopefully you can get something worked out with the PTO and be able to keep it

[J-Mech]

Originally Posted by mjsoldcub

Very cool..are those about the size of a 8-9n ford?? 4 cyl??Live hydr, or with pto??never seen one in person... I like that, very good score..just be cool to see someone mowing yard on one of those..

Nah, they're smaller than a 8N. A 185 is rated at about 15-16hp. Live hydraulics. Yes it has a rear independent live PTO, but it turn backwards. I don't plan to mow with this one. Not the yard anyway. The local school still has one. It's a red 184. I don't think they use it anymore, but they did when I was in school. Matter of fact, they had a 784 International with a belly mower that they mowed with too!! That's a pretty big tractor to use as a mower!

[mjsoldcub]

Sounds cool, why did the cubs pto turn backwards? To sell their own implements?? That will be something sweet with some lugged tires on it...

[J-Mech]

Originally Posted by jimbob200521

Great looking acquisition! I can't wait till you get it going. Hopefully you can get something worked out with the PTO and be able to keep it

I'm excited about it! I hope I can do something with the PTO too. It may just prove to be too expensive. We'll see.

Originally Posted by mjsoldcub

Sounds cool, why did the cubs pto turn backwards? To sell their own implements?? That will be something sweet with some lugged tires on it...

Well, no it didn't have anything to do with proprietary implements. The implements were made for the tractor because of the PTO turning backwards.

Here's the reason. Most engines turn counter clockwise looking at the rear of the engine. (There are a few cases where that isn't true, but it's a pretty inclusive rule.) With rare exception, as in the Cubs and some older Kubota's, the PTO turns clockwise when looking at it. Which would be the opposite way the engine turns. That is because they are driven off of the lower shaft (or a shaft inside of the lower shaft) of the transmission. That just wasn't possible with the F-Cubs and cub cadets because of room. So, they are driven off the top shaft of the trans, and that makes them turn the wrong way. I can supply pics, if that doesn't make any sense.

[Shrewcub]

Originally Posted by J-Mech

Here's the reason. Most engines turn counter clockwise looking at the rear of the engine. (There are a few cases where that isn't true, but it's a pretty inclusive rule.) With rare exception, as in the Cubs and some older Kubota's, the PTO turns clockwise when looking at it.

I guess that's why Kohler considers the PTO side of the engine the rear.
Magnums anyway, I don't know on the K's.

[J-Mech]

Originally Posted by Shrewcub

I guess that's why Kohler considers the PTO side of the engine the rear.
Magnums anyway, I don't know on the K's.

I have incorrectly thought for years that the Kohler motors turned backwards. That is not the case. They are installed backwards, according to Kohler. It's kind of an odd case because most engines, the "rear" of the motor is the flywheel end. On an air cooled engine, the flywheel is not considered the "power" end, the end with the PTO is. All Kohler motors are labeled this way. The PTO end is the technical rear. That is the reason that on the diesel cubs, the flywheel end is at the front. Because the Kohler is backwards installed, the diesel has to be too.

[Sam Mac]

Originally Posted by J-Mech

I have incorrectly thought for years that the Kohler motors turned backwards. That is not the case. They are installed backwards, according to Kohler. It's kind of an odd case because most engines, the "rear" of the motor is the flywheel end. On an air cooled engine, the flywheel is not considered the "power" end, the end with the PTO is. All Kohler motors are labeled this way. The PTO end is the technical rear. That is the reason that on the diesel cubs, the flywheel end is at the front. Because the Kohler is backwards installed, the diesel has to be too.

Think I recall you and I having this discussion before.

[J-Mech]

Originally Posted by Sam Mac

Think I recall you and I having this discussion before.

Yes we have! I agree with you.

[mjsoldcub]

Thanks, thats good stuff...no i understand, i just was wondering why they didnt engineer around that, unless it opened up a special market to sell their own pto driven implements, but you explained it well..not much room on a gt and they were the first driven by shaft which changed things, right??

[J-Mech]

Originally Posted by mjsoldcub

Thanks, thats good stuff...no i understand, i just was wondering why they didnt engineer around that, unless it opened up a special market to sell their own pto driven implements, but you explained it well..not much room on a gt and they were the first driven by shaft which changed things, right??

The PTO's don't run in reverse because of them being shaft driven. That's not why they didn't have room. They couldn't run the PTO off the lower shaft because the differential is driven off the lower shaft. In almost all other transmissions (cars, trucks, tractors) the top shaft is a two piece unit. An input, and and output. The rear of the top shaft is the pinion gear. The lower shaft is one piece and just is used to make gears. On the cub/cadet trans the lower shaft is the pinion, and the top shaft is one piece. There was no way, with out making a completely new trans, to run the PTO the "correct" direction. So, it became what it is. Then, so that it has a use, in the F-Cub and lo-boy line, they built attachments for it. Kinda like the supers and the Cat 0 tillers, and the rear mower. Only, on the older gear drive cubs, IH never made any attachments for them. I suspect they intended to, but didn't.