Diesel Starter Upgrade Question

[FrankF3]

Thanks for the info jrarick. However I still am having the no-start condition WITH the starter upgrade performed. That is why I wondered about a harness replacement. Matt G started me thinking and maybe I can just replace the positive lead with a new heavier one and try that. Is there anything else that can cause this problem? I remember years ago there was a recall on the 1572 where the backside of the circuitbreaker had to be double nutted to prevent the ring terminals from getting hot and melting into the plastic mounting. When I go thte 782D, I performed that upgrade. Do you think a defective circuitbreaker could be doing this ?

[ol'George]

When you turn the key to the start position, in essence you are putting battery voltage to the starter sol through the key switch and associated wiring/safety switches.
If the sol is not “clicking” you need to see it you have battery voltage @ the small terminal on the sol.@ the starter
If you have voltage there and it is not operating the sol/starter the problem is there in the sol or starter,or heavy lead from battery not supplying power to starter.
If you don’t have voltage @ the small terminal, you need to back track the wiring to find out where it is not continuing through the circuitry like a safety foot switch on hydro, or seat switch or PTO switch etc.
It would be nice if someone was helping who could hold the switch in start position
(When it is not operating correctly) and one by one check for voltage through the associated wiring/components & switches.
Also check the problematic plug on the back of the ing. switch
Hope this helps as intermittent electrical problems are difficult to find when they are not
malfunctioning to say the least.

[FrankF3]

Thanks ol'George, when i turn the key to the start position, I hear the dreaded solenoid clunk. the same as you would hear if you had a dead battery. With someone holding the key in this position, I have 12V on the small terminal on the starter and 12 v on the large battery terminal/cable on the starter. for all purposes, it should work. I've thrown a solenoid and 2 starters at it including the starter upgrade. It always works for a couple of weeks after messin' with it, then it goes back to it's old ways once everything settles back in. I've also replaced the ignition switch. My list of what's left to replace is getting pretty small.

[ol'George]

If the sol. is "clicking" we know the power is making it all the way there, and the internal coil is pulling in the contacts, but what we don't know is if they are making contact inside the sol.-----
and if you have battery voltage on the large terminal, it would have to be either the sol. contacts are not making contact or they are making contact, and the problem is in the starter internally.
I understand the starter is new ( and it is frustraiting)
Now make sure the large wire has good contact on it's crimped terminals (on both ends) I've seen them appear good but when asked to transmit large amperage they loose contact.
sometimes a teltail is them getting very warm. but not always.
Given what you have replaced, I have to tend to not believe it is in the starter/sol. (of course we have seen spanking new be defective)
So I would be looking if we are really carrying not only voltage to the heavy starter terminal, but amprage also. Are you getting a large voltage drop in the click/no start situation @ the large starter terminal?
That would indicate a bad connection.
Also remember without a good ground from battery to engine you will have the same problem, as the power has to make it there AND back through a ground.
Something you may try if the above tests fail is to tap lightly on the sol. while in the click/no start situation to see if it starts, I would not recommend hitting it hard and do not hit the starter as they have a perment magnet inside that is easily broken, ruining the starter.
if that works it's time to remove the starter/sol as it is there the problem lies.

[j knight]

Use a 12 Volt test lamp is the easiest way. Connect it to the Neg post on the battery; Then use the pointed end on the Postitive post of the battery.
See how bright the bulb is.
Then leave the clamp on the neg post of the battery and check at the starter the battery lead and the lead from the key switch.
It should be just as bright as it was on the battery.
A Volt meter will show Voltage but not Amperage.
With the test lamp if you do not have Amperage to the starter it will glow dim.

[j knight]

To check the voltage drop. (to check for bad wire connections) Connect one lead of the volt meter to the Positive terminal on the battery. Connect the other lead to the positive post on the starter wire from the key. Leave the wire connected to the starter. Turn the key to the start position. Now read the Voltmeter while holding the key to start. If the Volt meter reads over .5 Volt there is a problem in the wire from the battery to the starter.
Check the wiring diag. and see how many times it changes wires to get there.
Ie From + post thru all the connections and finally to the starter.
Hope I did not leave you wondering.

[jrarick]

The starter relay was inexpensive and easy to install and I felt I had nothing to loose. I had done some research and found other folks having good results with the relay-- so if it worked-- great--if not I would try something more drastic.

Before the relay my starter would click anywhere from 2 or 3 times to 12 or more before engaging starter. Very frustrating for sure.
After installing relay ( about 3 years ago) it has not clicked once.

[FrankF3]

Originally Posted by jrarick

The starter relay was inexpensive and easy to install and I felt I had nothing to loose. I had done some research and found other folks having good results with the relay-- so if it worked-- great--if not I would try something more drastic.

Before the relay my starter would click anywhere from 2 or 3 times to 12 or more before engaging starter. Very frustrating for sure.
After installing relay ( about 3 years ago) it has not clicked once.

Frustrating to say the least, Ive come this far with it I've got to be close to fixing it.

I have to work late tomorrow, but the first chance I get I now have some new tests to go on - Thanks ol'George and j knight!!

I since I need an extra set of hands. I get my wife or son to see if they can turn the key to the start/run position and I'll try to measure the voltage drop. I'll let you all know what turns up.

[ol'George]

Originally Posted by FrankF3

Frustrating to say the least, Ive come this far with it I've got to be close to fixing it.

I have to work late tomorrow, but the first chance I get I now have some new tests to go on - Thanks ol'George and j knight!!

I since I need an extra set of hands. I get my wife or son to see if they can turn the key to the start/run position and I'll try to measure the voltage drop. I'll let you all know what turns up.

The family that plays/works together stays together. quality learning time ,-- warms my heart

[ACecil]

Originally Posted by ol'George

The family that plays/works together stays together. quality learning time ,-- warms my heart

Well said, George!