Haban H42 on 782

[Redblower]

Originally Posted by cnysabo

Hi MWShaw,
I just stumbled on your thread because I have been getting somewhat frustrated with shearing bolts on my snow thrower. I have a H48 mounted on a 1641. "Also I noticed in the picture of your actual shear pins, they seem to be clevice pins, without any groove etched into them. I can actually get some of those at Lowes, is that a type of shear pin I should perhaps be using? When this system works, it's great. But when it fails without a consistent pattern, then it is frustrating. Anyway, I will keep reading what gets posted. thanks.

MW Shaw is right as far as I know about that being the correct shear pin, it may look like a clevis pin but that is what they give you at the IH dealer and that's what mine had in it when I got it, with the little spiral split ring (see pic, which also costs about $.50 more than the pin?!?) to hold it in. I have not seen the ones with grooves? have seen ones that look like shoulder bolts but can't find one of those that is long enough. I have not bent or broken a shear pin (geeze! hope I don't jinx myself) and have't checked but I believe mine is set up with the key and set screw on the other end.

The issue I'm having is on the other end, but by that parts shot you have I can't tell what #'s 6 & 9 are?
I also wondered the same thing, if we used grade 5 or heaven forbid grade 8 bolts in there won't the belt slip when there is a problem?
Maybe some of these more experienced guys know the answer, I too would hate to sabotage the system but it does get very frustrating.
Any ideas are greatly appreciated.
Thanks, Vic

[MWShaw]

Originally Posted by Redblower

The issue I'm having is on the other end, but by that parts shot you have I can't tell what #'s 6 & 9 are?

Thanks, Vic

#6 is a sleeve spacer, and #9 are "C" clips. That schematic shows our pulleys being held on with the "C" clips.

That is an error, our pulleys are held on with the square head bolt.

That sleeve and "C" clips are what hold the driveshaft yoke, onto the gearbox output shaft.

That's why even when the shear pin breaks, the shaft stays on the gearbox, just free spinning.

[MWShaw]

Originally Posted by Redblower

MW Shaw is right as far as I know about that being the correct shear pin, it may look like a clevis pin but that is what they give you at the IH dealer and that's what mine had in it when I got it, with the little spiral split ring (see pic, which also costs about $.50 more than the pin?!?) to hold it in.
Thanks, Vic

Just to be clear, those are the correct pins, as per the Cub Cadet parts program.

But I believe that is the problem. Those pins are .248", the I.D. of the hole (from the factory) is .295". That .048" of slop, is way too much, the yoke just hammers back and forth, until the pin breaks.

[cnysabo]

Originally Posted by MWShaw

Seeing as how the skematic images I posted, are supposed to be for the H42 and the H48, I would think you should have the 3/16 key at the spocket end also? Funny thing, mine has a 3/8-16 set screw drilled and tapped, right above the key on the sprocket end of the driveshaft. (It is not shown in the skematic?)I guess maybe it's some a previous owner added, but why is the jam nut on that backing off also?

The tapped hole for the set screw is on mine to. Opposite the grease fitting nut on the universal joint at the gear box end. I don't remember there being a set screw in there when I got it, it could be a part that fit some other models and it was just easier for production to make it truly a universal part. But as of right now, I don't have the parallel key in it either. I just plan to use that part of the system as the shear point.

That being said, I did decide to put a new grade 2 bolt in the shear pin hole today and to my absolute amazement it worked perfectly the whole 1hr+ I used it. What I did differently was tighten it down like I had read elsewhere should be done. I guess it held the extra movement at bay long enough that it didn't hammer the bolt in two.
Also, just for the record, I used a 1/4" grade 2 bolt that was 2 1/2 inches long with a regular washer on the bolt end and a nylon lock nut on the either side. I ran out of the 2" ones, but maybe that is why it held together better. With the 2 1/2" long bolt 2/3rds of the shank is unthreaded. All that is threaded sticks out the other side. Could that little bit of extra metal give it some added strength? In effect, the actually part of the bolt being stressed then resembles your legitimate shear pins above. I'm going to have to go and dig through the broken bolts to see where they break off. Anyway, at this point I'm up and running and interestingly enough, by the end of the day the belt was what was slipping in the heavy stuff.
Hope the battle is improving on your end.

[MWShaw]

Yes, both of my yokes were tapped above the key. Odd thing was the sprocket end was drilled and tapped 3/8"-16. The on at the gearbox was 1/4"-20?

I no longer have any shear pins, that are holding torque. I keyed both end, gearbox and sprocket. Lots of red Loctite.

It's snowing here now, I'll put it to the test tomorrow.

[Jeff in Pa]

Originally Posted by cnysabo

..........................
Also, just for the record, I used a 1/4" grade 2 bolt that was 2 1/2 inches long with a regular washer on the bolt end and a nylon lock nut on the either side. I ran out of the 2" ones, but maybe that is why it held together better. With the 2 1/2" long bolt 2/3rds of the shank is unthreaded. All that is threaded sticks out the other side. Could that little bit of extra metal give it some added strength? In effect, the actually part of the bolt being stressed then resembles your legitimate shear pins above. I'm going to have to go and dig through the broken bolts to see where they break off. Anyway, at this point I'm up and running and interestingly enough, by the end of the day the belt was what was slipping in the heavy stuff.
Hope the battle is improving on your end.

I was reading about driveshaft couplers and the person highly suggested getting bolts long enough that the full body was thru the coupler and to use washers to make it tight. This particular set up used two bolts so one was inserted from one side and the other bolt from the otherside so the extra length didn't offset the balance. ( a drive shaft spins at up to 3600 rpm )

[Redblower]

Originally Posted by MWShaw

#6 is a sleeve spacer, and #9 are "C" clips. That schematic shows our pulleys being held on with the "C" clips.

That is an error, our pulleys are held on with the square head bolt.

That sleeve and "C" clips are what hold the driveshaft yoke, onto the gearbox output shaft.

That's why even when the shear pin breaks, the shaft stays on the gearbox, just free spinning.

When I got it there was a "C" clip on the end, a key and 3/8-16 set screw, the key way on the pulley is "worn out" so the key rolls over even though the set screw is tight with red loctite.
After I drilled the other hole out, 90 degrees from the key way, the first 1/4-20 bolts I put in were just long enough, i.e. threads in the contact area. After 2 of those broke I put in a grade 8 that is long enough, 2 1/2" if I remember right, that is is almost all "shank" in the contact area. I like the idea of getting even a little longer and using washers.
I think my big problem now is that the pulley is so worn that it is wobbling on the shaft, as mentioned earlier, I hope it's the pulley and not the shaft.
Vic

[cnysabo]

Well, maybe your onto a better design which would be great! There doesn't seem like there is anything that you've done that you can't undo if it doesn't work as well as imagined. I would just probably back off on the belt tension a little at first and increase it accordingly. Only because I once blew the oil seal out from behind the pto on my 1641 when I was mowing the garden down... I guess the corn stalks and broccoli stalks were a little hard on it. It seemed like a good idea at the time, in fact it still seems like a good idea because I still tend to do it with a slight apprehension each fall. Anyway, the seal was easy enough to replace.

One other thing that I just realized, and maybe it's already been discussed... but in the parts diagram, the 3/16" parallel key (part #35) is only shown on the sprocket end of the shaft, but not on the gear box end even though the groove is cut in the shaft for it. Also the shear pin is shown on the gear box end. So this leads me to believe that is the place Haban intended to shear. Which is the easier access of the two and it is the way my H48 came.

[MWShaw]

Originally Posted by Redblower

When I got it there was a "C" clip on the end, a key and 3/8-16 set screw, the key way on the pulley is "worn out" so the key rolls over even though the set screw is tight with red loctite.
After I drilled the other hole out, 90 degrees from the key way, the first 1/4-20 bolts I put in were just long enough, i.e. threads in the contact area. After 2 of those broke I put in a grade 8 that is long enough, 2 1/2" if I remember right, that is is almost all "shank" in the contact area. I like the idea of getting even a little longer and using washers.
I think my big problem now is that the pulley is so worn that it is wobbling on the shaft, as mentioned earlier, I hope it's the pulley and not the shaft.
Vic

I'm sorry, I missed that yours was a problem with the pulley. My pulley had a square head bolt holding it on.

Originally Posted by cnysabo

Well, maybe your onto a better design which would be great! There doesn't seem like there is anything that you've done that you can't undo if it doesn't work as well as imagined. I would just probably back off on the belt tension a little at first and increase it accordingly. Only because I once blew the oil seal out from behind the pto on my 1641 when I was mowing the garden down... I guess the corn stalks and broccoli stalks were a little hard on it. It seemed like a good idea at the time, in fact it still seems like a good idea because I still tend to do it with a slight apprehension each fall. Anyway, the seal was easy enough to replace.

One other thing that I just realized, and maybe it's already been discussed... but in the parts diagram, the 3/16" parallel key (part #35) is only shown on the sprocket end of the shaft, but not on the gear box end even though the groove is cut in the shaft for it. Also the shear pin is shown on the gear box end. So this leads me to believe that is the place Haban intended to shear. Which is the easier access of the two and it is the way my H48 came.

You are correct, it does appear that Haban wanted the "sacrificial" part (shear pin) to be at the gearbox, the sprocket end was not intended to shear. One of the previous owners of mine, must have lost the key at the sprocket end, and never replaced it.

[MWShaw]

2.5 hours tonight, happy so far. Here's a short video of the Haban. Sorry it so shaky, tire chains on concrete!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7zUO...=share&index=1