Cold starting difficulties

[teejk]

Originally Posted by ol'George

That what they taught us, back before Chevy V8's were born.
That high octane burns slower to allow the flame front to progress over the piston area in a controlled fashion, if too fast of a burn occurs and/or multiple flame fronts are produced, a knock occurs when they collide.
A lot of owner’s manuals state just what you posted, no need to purchase higher octane than you need.
As a side note, I think with today’s economy and most folks buying regular,
it is likely that premium has been in their tanks a lot longer than regular.
When you start pushing 10- 10.5 to 1 compression, premium becomes necessary, not the low compression engines we use in our cubs.

I think any air-cooled engine should run premium in the days of ethanol additives. the ethanol has a tendency to separate from the gasoline and is not a good thing. Premium fuel is usually ethanol free (check your pump before you pay the $$$).

[Mike1450]

Changing the original battery cables to heavier gauge 6 or 8 gauge wire will help cranking in the cold weather. This will help deliver more power to the starter instead of dropping it in the cable. I had the same issue on my 1450 in the cold, it cranks very well now since i made new cables and starts right off.

[ol'George]

Originally Posted by teejk

I think any air-cooled engine should run premium in the days of ethanol additives. the ethanol has a tendency to separate from the gasoline and is not a good thing. Premium fuel is usually ethanol free (check your pump before you pay the $$$).

I respectfully disagree, unless it is modified/high compression that needs it. but as you say it is all about what a person wants to do.
I do agree ethanol addition is not the best thing we have to live with.
I hate to see what is gonna happen when they push 15% on us, with a 3 gallon minimum purchase @ the pump, if it is a blend type of pump.
but that is for another discussion.

[teejk]

Originally Posted by ol'George

I respectfully disagree, unless it is modified/high compression that needs it. but as you say it is all about what a person wants to do.
I do agree ethanol addition is not the best thing we have to live with.
I hate to see what is gonna happen when they push 15% on us, with a 3 gallon minimum purchase @ the pump, if it is a blend type of pump.
but that is for another discussion.

I got that ethanol thing from the guy that I buy my power equipment from after hearing it from a friend that works for a utility company...

go ahead and google <ethanol fuel separation>...my take is that ethanol fuel not used promptly is poison in air-cooled machines. the articles all talk about water absorbtion but I think it's more about burning pure alchohol (HOT) when it separates.

[Mike McKown]

Originally Posted by teejk

I got that ethanol thing from the guy that I buy my power equipment from after hearing it from a friend that works for a utility company...

go ahead and google <ethanol fuel separation>...my take is that ethanol fuel not used promptly is poison in air-cooled machines. the articles all talk about water absorbtion but I think it's more about burning pure alchohol (HOT) when it separates.

You are talking about "phase separation". Ethanol mixes easily with gasoline. Ethanol also mixes easily with water.

An ethanol/gasoline combo can hold a slight amount of water in suspension and run it right through the engine without problems.

The problems start when the fuel combo absorbs too much water for the gasoline to hold in suspension and the water falls to the bottom of the tank. Thus, you'll have basically watery fuel on the bottom, water/ethanol/gasoline in a middle layer and gasoline, robbed of it's octane in the top layer as the light stuff in the gasoline has settled to lower layers.

This is VERY generic description of what happens to E 10 gasoline when left exposed to the atmosphere or even an uncapped can that sits out in the rain.

Use ONLY SEALED gas cans for your small engine gasoline storage and rotate it frequently and I don't think you will have problems with E 10.

PS. Once phase separation takes place in your gasoline, the best thing you can do is dispose of it. It cannot be recycled to make it a usable fuel. If you try it, guaranteed you will have problems.

[teejk]

Originally Posted by Mike McKown

You are talking about "phase separation". Ethanol mixes easily with gasoline. Ethanol also mixes easily with water.

An ethanol/gasoline combo can hold a slight amount of water in suspension and run it right through the engine without problems.

The problems start when the fuel combo absorbs too much water for the gasoline to hold in suspension and the water falls to the bottom of the tank. Thus, you'll have basically watery fuel on the bottom, water/ethanol/gasoline in a middle layer and gasoline, robbed of it's octane in the top layer as the light stuff in the gasoline has settled to lower layers.

This is VERY generic description of what happens to E 10 gasoline when left exposed to the atmosphere or even an uncapped can that sits out in the rain.

Use ONLY SEALED gas cans for your small engine gasoline storage and rotate it frequently and I don't think you will have problems with E 10.

PS. Once phase separation takes place in your gasoline, the best thing you can do is dispose of it. It cannot be recycled to make it a usable fuel. If you try it, guaranteed you will have problems.

I'm not a scientist so will accept your explanation. It explains why newer gas cans require 5 hands to operate!

But it does seem that E10 burns hotter than plain old gas and that seems to be the complaint heard from people that run tools for a living. I haven't researched it yet but I see that Stabil now markets a product specifically for ethanol blends.

[Mr.Goffena]

don't assume your battery is good by how it looks. I have seen many batteries in tractors that look newer but are over 10 years old. Pull it out and have it tested. Most auto stores will test for free.

[mmzullo]

To add to this my 149/loader has always had problems starting in the cold. Last year I modified the battery tray to get a 675 cca battery in it. Smallest battery at wal mart. I put larger cables on it also at the same time. The engine/battery NEVER had cranking problems. But would be a PITA to start. It started with 1/4 throttle and full choke to almost off choke. Every time to can see smoke coming out the exhaust then it almost starts. A couple cycles of this and it will start. This is not correct. I've done head gasket, points, can, sp. Never tried a coil but spark is nice and blue. I've been through the carb. I think it's a fuel issue in the cold.
But I think 14 hp are the worst to start in the cold. My 127 always starts.
I wish the s/g did turn the engine over faster. But engine speed was never an issue in the summer to start. I have the larger pulley on the s/g already. Go larger? anyone ever try it?

[TheSaturnV]

I apologize if I missed something, but has the S/G been refurbished? Fresh bearings, brushes and a good cleaning of the commutator will do wonders for your startups.

[jr315]

has any one know what i can do to make my 782 start its got a kohler 2nd series , runs mint when started but just a bear to start when cold.