Troubleshooting weak starter on 1650.... looking for advice

[prskier17]

On Monday I attempted to start my 1650 that had been sitting at around 12 degrees F all day and it would barely turn over. It ran the previous day at 30 degrees F. I thought the battery might be weak so attempted to jump start from my car. I ended up getting the started hot and it started smoking so I gave up for the night. I purchased a new 300CCA battery.... charged it and am getting the same weak starter that just barely turns the engine over. No I'm thinking it's either a bad wire connection or maybe a smoked starter. Thoughts on troubleshooting??? Should I try using jumpers between the battery and starter to see if the starters good?

[ronalddipietro]

You could always take the battery and starter off...take them to you nearest auto parts house and have them tested.

[prskier17]

Well the battery was brand new yesterday, so I'm pretty sure it's not the culprit. I'll have to look through the wiring. What is the best way to verify the starter is functioning properly?

[TheSaturnV]

Bypass the key switch and solenoid by jumping right to the starter.

[teejk]

runs at 30F but not at 12F...start with an oil change I think! SAE 30 is the spec for >32F but then Kohler says drop to a multi-vis oil of 5W-20 or 5W-30 (can go 10W also but only down to 0F and if you are already 12F in December, skip that stage and go directly to the 5W).

all kidding aside (maybe not), give all your connections a shot of WD40 (key switch, PTO switch and solenoid).

"stiff oil" might be your problem but that starter should still turn it better than what you describe.

So trying the cheapest stuff first. I'd check voltage to the solenoid and then to the starter. Then I'd check grounds (battery to frame is easy enough but then realize that the front bolt of your starter holds a ground wire that attaches to your frame on the right front corner where the "nose" meets the frame).

[Matt G.]

Originally Posted by teejk

runs at 30F but not at 12F...start with an oil change I think! SAE 30 is the spec for >32F but then Kohler says drop to a multi-vis oil of 5W-20 or 5W-30 (can go 10W also but only down to 0F and if you are already 12F in December, skip that stage and go directly to the 5W).

all kidding aside (maybe not), give all your connections a shot of WD40 (key switch, PTO switch and solenoid).

"stiff oil" might be your problem but that starter should still turn it better than what you describe.

So trying the cheapest stuff first. I'd check voltage to the solenoid and then to the starter. Then I'd check grounds (battery to frame is easy enough but then realize that the front bolt of your starter holds a ground wire that attaches to your frame on the right front corner where the "nose" meets the frame).

What good is WD-40 going to do for corroded electrical connections?

If it turns over at all, the problem is not the solenoid or the wiring that activates it...it will either work properly or not. I agree that all of the grounds need to be checked and cleaned if necessary. Before doing too much I would remove the starter and check on the condition of the brushes and commutator. If the brushes are worn and commutator dirty it may be weak. The cables from the battery to solenoid and solenoid to starter can corrode and develop high resistance, causing them to get hot, but I suspect the problem in this case lies within the starter itself. If the starter started smoking, the wiring to it is probably capable of carrying the amount of current it needs.

[R Bedell]

Did you check to see if your battery cables are clean, polished, tight, and down to good bare metal on both ends?

[ol'George]

I worked on a friends 1650 some years back and it did not have a starter/gen
it had a Perm mag newer style starter.
That said, if putting the + jumper wire on the starter terminal gives the same results as described, then take the starter off and dis assy it to look for problems.
Especially checking the brushes AND if the perm. magnets are cracked or have come unglued.
If it spins/starts easily with jumper attached to starter the terminal,
then it is in associated wiring, and you need to trouble shoot that.

[teejk]

Originally Posted by Matt G.

What good is WD-40 going to do for corroded electrical connections?

If it turns over at all, the problem is not the solenoid or the wiring that activates it...it will either work properly or not. I agree that all of the grounds need to be checked and cleaned if necessary. Before doing too much I would remove the starter and check on the condition of the brushes and commutator. If the brushes are worn and commutator dirty it may be weak. The cables from the battery to solenoid and solenoid to starter can corrode and develop high resistance, causing them to get hot, but I suspect the problem in this case lies within the starter itself. If the starter started smoking, the wiring to it is probably capable of carrying the amount of current it needs.

maybe I'm wrong but I think WD40 was invented to clean electric connections without tearing them apart (water displacement formula 40 as I recall).

maybe just luck but I've seen it work before, it will remove surface rust, everybody has a can of it, it can be directed to where needed and it doesn't hurt anything if it doesn't work.

sorry I offended you with a cheap/easy attempted solution.

the fact that it turned at 30F but not at 12F...does suggest a weak starter but I think I would try everything else before tearing the starter out and rebuilding it (Kohler brush set is about $60 for that thing...I know all about it since I bit a month or two ago).

[Matt G.]

You can do what you want with your tractor, but I'd prefer to remove the connector and clean it manually. WD-40 will leave residue that will collect more dirt that will eventually absorb water and start the process all over again.

An aftermarket brush kit is about $10, no more expensive than new battery cables.