thinning CC paints?

[thenrie]

I asked this question months ago, but can't find the thread again, and my old brain just can't seem to keep stuff like this for long anymore. I bought CC paints by the quart to paint my 1650, but there are no instructions of any kind on the label as to how to thin or cleanup. Doesn't even say what kind of paint it is. What do you guys thin the CC paint with and what ratio? I have a good compressor and I bought a Harbor Freight HVLP set to spray with. Haven't used it yet. I'm going to try to get this thing painted before it gets too cold again.

[hydrocub]

I would like some thought on this also...Been working tiial and error
with it .

[thenrie]

Well, I found a thread where Matt says he mixes Valspar paint at 16:1:1, paint:thinner:retarder (I think that was it), thinning with naptha. Not sure, but I think the CC paint is Valspar. Seems like I remember reading that other members were thinning the CC paint with straight mineral spirits, but I don't remember the ratio. I have mineral spirits available, so I'm going to see how that works. I'll let you know what I learn.

Trying to search for anything on "thinning" or "paint" produced so much unrelated info that I pooped out after several pages.

[NealC]

Thenrie,

Applying paint is one of those subjects that can turn into very long draw out debate. There are many opinions as to what is right and wrong. This posting is probably going to stir up a HUGE can of worms, but you are requesting advice, so I will give it.

First, if you are spending the money for a better than spray can finish, you should only buy paint from a paint supplier that mixes and tints to your request. They can match any color out there. When you purchase paint from other places, (even IH & CC dealers) you do not know exactly what you may get until you open the can. Or, how long it has been on the shelf.

The average shelf life on many paint materials is 6 months. Not only will a paint supplier freshly mix the paint exactly like you ask, they will also be able to answer any questions you may have about application. If you find they don't want to answer your questions, go to a supplier who will. The extra cost paid for the material at a paint specific store is easily made up by the knowledge the supplier has about their product.

That being said, you have already purchased some paint so let's start there. There is no formula for the amount of thinner to add to paint. It is all based on it's viscosity (thickness) and the type of application you plan to use. In your case, HVLP. Viscosity is measured with a viscosity cup.

The reason for this is because so many things affect the viscosity of the material. The air temperature, humidity, pigment content & solvent content are just a few of the factors that affect a paints viscosity. In an industrial application setting, viscosity readings will be taken many times a day. Especially when opening new containers of paint. If you follow a formula of "x amount of solvent to x amount of paint" you will never end up with the same thing twice.

A viscosity cup is a cup (imagine that!) with a precise sized hole in the bottom. After thoroughly mixing the paint (before adding any solvent), you dip the cup in the paint then hold the cup steady so the level of the paint is the same height as the lip (top) of the cup. With a stopwatch in hand, you quickly, but steadily raise the entire cup out of the paint. At this instant, start the stopwatch. A steady stream of paint will flow from the hole in the bottom of the cup and back into the container. As soon as that stream breaks and becomes a drip, stop the stop watch and note how many seconds it took for this to happen. Repeat at least twice to verify similar readings.

Thinner paints take less time to empty from the cup. Thicker paints take longer. Record how many seconds it took for the cup to empty, and what the air temperature and humidity level are. You now have a reference to go back to for applications at later dates.

There are many types of viscosity cups out there, but the most popular is what we refer to as a #2 Zahn. Even when you start referring to a specific size cup, there are dozens of choices as to which #2 Zahn you use. Since they are a precision measuring device, prices and quality can vary. Shop around.

Your paint supplier should be able to tell you how thick the paint should be for proper application. Again, since you already have paint, you can go with a "rule of thumb" that HVLP guns spray best with a viscosity of 14 seconds or less, normally not below 10 seconds, in a #2 Zahn cup. Add small amounts of solvent (thinner) as needed. If your application time will take longer than a hour, (lots of parts) periodically check viscosity again.

Without knowing what type of paint you currently have, I can not recommend which thinner to use.

Sorry for this overly detailed post, I hope I didn't put you to sleep!

[Matt G.]

If you thin with mineral spirits, you may dissolve the primer. Check your primer by spraying a test piece with the primer, letting it dry for a couple days, and then try to wipe if off with a rag soaked in mineral spirits. If it wipes off...don't thin with mineral spirits. I found this out the hard way once when I was wiping dust off of my parts with a mineral-spirits-soaked rag before spraying the topcoat.

If you are using the Valspar hardener, read the can and follow the directions, as I believe you have to mix the hardener, thinner, and paint, and then let them sit for 30 minutes before spraying.

I also agree with everything NealC said...I have done it both ways, and the cheap auto paint has much less guesswork.

[Lmercer]

This is all good reading. Last week I bought Iron Gard from the dealer to start spraying this weekend. They carried the IH thinner for it and a new Valspar hardener, Renew. They said most people just went and got an automotive hardener.

I checked with a couple of the local NAPA stores that I knew used to carry and mix paint, and neither did anymore and just had some stuff on the shelf, but couldn't tell me what might work.

I work close to a Sherwin Williams Auto Paint supplier so I went in there today. They were very reluctant to sell me anything to put in the Iron Gard paint as they were afraid as to how it would dry or stick. I did appreciate the fact that they just weren't interested in the sale. I asked them how much their paint was and it was almost 3X the Iron Gard.

Later I called them and asked if they could cross reference a NAPA # and if they could, I was going to buy some reducer and hardener from them and take my chances. When I got there, they offered to match the price of the Iron Gard so that they knew the reducer and hardener would be compatible.

I quickly called the implement dealer where I bought the paint and asked them if I could return it if it was unopened and they said I could. Sooooo, I bought the Sherwin Williams and will hopefully be trying it out this weekend.

This will be my 1st attempt, but I'm one of those guys who gets pretty anal in my research so I hope it all turns out.

[Matt G.]

I think you'll be glad you sprung for the auto paint...it's good stuff. I use the Valspar for attachments and stuff that is going to get destroyed anyway, but if I do another tractor again, it will be with auto paint. Follow the instructions that the paint came with and you'll be fine. One tip that may not be on the sheet is that the viscosity of the paint varies depending on the color. The IH 901 white PPG Shop Line that I used on the 100 I redid last year was too thin if any reducer was added. The reducer is kind of an 'optional' thing and you may have to adjust the ratio slightly depending on how well it sprays.

Another tip: Try to not be in a hurry to reassemble. If you can wait a month before reassembly, do so. The paint will be much harder by then than it will be 24-48 hours after. Also, don't spill any gas on fresh paint, it will bubble it. Don't ask how I know that...

The next tractor I restore, I will probably paint and then wait 2-3 months to reassemble to cut down on the damage to the coat of paint.

[Lmercer]

Thanks Matt. I am hoping to get it all painted this week and let it set a month before reassembly. I won't get the snow blade painted this year, but I will have enough to do it next year.

[NealC]

Lmercer,

Congrats on finding a good paint supplier and developing a relationship with them! Most people will agree the most important part of a good paint job is the prep work.

[nikster]

Great information guys,

Thanks,

Nik,