Cub Cadet XT1 LT50" no oil, engine trashed
 

Hi Yall! Hope to get some experienced feedback on my issue...

My cubby is about a year into its 3 year warranty and has only 20 hours on the meter. Recently I had an issue with not starting.

These are the things that happened during this period:
Gas tank empty, added gas, no start. Changed fuel filter just in case...
Gas leaked out at front of engine all over sidewalk.
During cranking, engine spun half turn only. Changed battery, just in case...

Called local auth. shop. They said probly float stuck by crap gas, causing leak. Said raw gas in cyl is why it wont spin. They were backed up for few weeks so left it on the sidewalk as-is.

During next few days I tried to restart. One day it did, I added gas, it was running normally, so I cut the grass, and no issues.

A week later I tried to use it but same issue with not starting, but it did spin freely. This time I added a half gallon gas and some seafoam, hoping to run it thru the carb and just let it sit to degunk it. But after a bit of cranking, it started, lots white smoke. After a few mins it cleared up and ran normally. I drove it to the driveway, out of my way. I checked the oil, dipstick had oil to almost full level.

I latched the seat interlock down, left the cowl open and let it run while I did other things. After about 15 mins or so, cubby had quit running. Now it wouldn't even spin.

At this point I called the shop, got an appointment and next day brought it to them. After a week they said engine was blown, no oil in crankcase so it would not be covered under warranty.

So here is almost a new engine, only 20 hours run time, and it was out of oil!
Their issue is, out of oil, not covered under warranty.
My issue is, out of oil was due to a defect in the engine. I checked it before last run and it was ok.

So, my new friends, what do you think? Should this kohler with 20 hrs on it run out of oil if the engine is free of defects?

color me confused and frustrated! :bigthink:
Thanks, seekertom

as of 01/24/19
WOW! final(?) update. cubby has been in shop from 10/07/18 until jan 18, 2019. Final resolution, according to mechanic, replaced short block due to engine seizure, no oil. Oil seems to have exited thru main crank seal which failed due to heat from low oil. (how did oil get low? leaked out of seal due to engine getting hot. why did engine get hot? it was low on oil. How did it get low on oil?????) yada.

anyhow, it was repaired under warranty, 3 1/2 months of which time was spent in custody of shop.
Two things I have noticed that may or may not be true and accurate: engine is noisier than before, and has a squeak while running, and when shutting it off, the last sound is a squeak. Also, full throttle, doesnt seem as fast as before.
Both these are subjective observations, but I will confer with the mechanic about them. For now, starts and runs smoothly, cuts the grass as before. Have no idea whether warranty will be extended to cover the 3 months mower was not 'on the road'.
Thanks for everyone's help here, and hope this info helps someone else in the future.

seekertom

Call Cub Cadet. Did you buy this from a dealer or a big box store?

Sam is right. The dealer will not help you but Cub might.

I am confused by the statement above. It leads me to think you checked oil and it was full. Then ran ok for 15 min. Unless it was pouring smoke whole time or it had a good size leak, the oil should not have been empty in 15 min. Now im not saying the dealer drained the oil so they could get the job outside of warranty but it does seem suspicious.

This is very odd...

Like stated before, if there was in fact that much oil in it, and 15 minutes later it locked up due to no oil, it would be blatantly obvious with a huge leak or burning oil terribly with smoke everywhere That oil has to go somewhere... either into the air from burning up or onto the ground.

IF you had a stuck float, it is possible that a variety of issues could have occurred...

Sounds like she needs an autopsy to figure out the real cause here. no way to know without opening her up, but like others stated, call Cub first. They may work with you.

20 hours and a blown engine? That is definitely concerning. Out of curiosity, did you change the "break in" oil at 5 hours? Please keep us updated on the outcome. I am interested as I have a 2 year old, 30 hour XT1 myself.

responses to questions abt xt1 eng fail
 

hope im doing this right...
1st, bt cubby from home depot, and has mfgrs 3 yrs warranty, up in june 2019
shop taken to is only auth warr svc shop in this area, so fl.

2nd, long after i took mower to shop i noticed a black spot on driveway unnoticed before. if you saw it you'd think maybe half cup very dirty oil made the 18" dia splotch. splotch is dry, btw, so unsure source, but easy to tell very small quantity. unsure if from the mower, but it is in the approx place mower was sitting when it died. dunno why it would be dirty black when the dipstick was clean. so, likely a full crankcase of oil was not dumped there. (just exploring all scenarios...) Another possibility is, since gas had been pouring out front of engine, I'm seeing gas marks on tar pvmt, not oil...

Lets assum that all the oil was gone even before all these issues. That means it left the engine while running around the yard cutting the grass, and over a period of maybe as much as a year. that alone indicates to me a defective engine, but i'd also have seen big drips in shed or on pavement if that was the case.

There's also a possibility I misread the dipstick. I know that I saw oil on it almost up to the full hole. only residual oil on stick? Even so, where did the oil go?

Another thing... engine died after a 10-15 min stationary run, supposedly out of oil. not smokey, burning oil. not a quart or more clean oil seen on pavement.

Takes me an hour to cut the grass. if it was out of oil and failed in 10 mins, why dint it fail after running an hour previously? looks like it had to lose the oil sometime after last grass cut, but no big oil spills in shed or sidewalk or driveway for a heads up.

At the moment shop has mower, has contacted warranty group. After their response I bitched like hell, asked them to revisit and tell them this determination is not acceptable. Shop response was, well, guess we'll have to tear down the engine to see what might have caused the oil to vanish... hmmmm?

Back to youze guyze! st:BangPC:


no, did not chg oil after 5 hrs.

Float stuck on carb and allowed gas to fill the engine. Shop stated this when you called them the first time. Gas filled crankcase and thinned oil. Oil/gas mix was thin enough to burn out of the engine. You saw “oil” on the dipstick, but it wasn’t just oil. Should have taken it to the shop after the initial issue. Spot on the driveway looks the way it does because of gas mixture. It would have helped the oil evaporate.

Not arguing with your theory. It is quite possible however, when he called the first time the tech made an assumption since he was not actually there to see it. He said it was leaking out of carb outside of engine. The tech assumed the engine might be fuel locked. Typically if gas is mixing with the crankcase oil you will overfill the crankcase showing above the full line. OP stated it was just below full line. He also said the oil looked to be clean. Is it even possible for oil to enter crankcase on this engine?? I think it has vac fuel pump so i think it would leak from bowl before entering crankcase.

You never changed the break in oil. That might be one of the reasons for premature failure.

What he said!
I know I would have taken it to them right away so I can yell at somebody.

Shop works on these tractors all the time. I'm sure they see the same problems repeatedly on these machines. I'd go with what they say. Not changing the break-on oil has nothing to do with gas leaking into the engine and emptying the crankcase.