Cub Cadet Creeper Gear on a 128 - Help
 

New to the forum, so this is my first post.
I am rebuilding a creeper for my 128, and having difficulty with where/how to install the Internal Snap Ring #716-3007.
There appears two different locations where this snap ring could go:
1. Fits around the lower part of the input shaft bearing, or
2. Fits inside the Input Shaft Bearing Cage.
If 1., it fits well on the bearing, but then I can’t get the input shaft down inside the housing far enough to install the Bearing Cage Retainer Snap Ring.
If 2, its very difficult (impossible?) to install in the Bearing Cage, and would result in the same issue as above.

I may be trying to install it in the wrong sequence, or some other unknown mistake. Unfortunately, there are very few instructions available regarding this topic.

I look forward to your reply.

Thanks and best regards,
Michael

Does this help any?

http://www.partstree.com/parts/cub-c...creeper-drive/





Cub Cadet 123

716-3007 is now 716-04098

#15 in drawing, also the bearing part number has changed. Maybe the styles have changed and you have an old/new mixture and they don't jive with each other??

http://www.cubcadet-parts-direct.com...0-A/0020000016

The problem is determining exactly where the snap ring should go, and then how to get it there.
Any suggestions?
Thanks!

I am not for sure if I fully understand your question. It goes on the front end of the creepy drive input shaft and you should use snap ring pliers to put it on. A good quality set of the snap ring pliers will save you a lot of frustration and the neighborhood from hearing a vast array of wordy dirds.

If I still did not address your question, then I apologize in advance. Just going by what you already stated.

Cub Cadet 123

Sorry for the confusion. I'm probably not stating the issue very clearly.

Is the snap ring installed in the groove of the bearing?

If i install it on the bearing, then the bearing cage will not "seat" fully into the creeper housing.

Then the (other) large snap ring that holds the cage in place can't be installed.

Thanks!

Alright.... give us numbers. The snap ring #15? It goes in the housing, not on the bearing. No snap rings attach to the bearing.

Attachment 74174

Thanks, J.
But where does the #15 snap ring attach?

It goes on #7 in the groove.

Lew, isn't it #8 that goes on the groove on #7?


#15 goes into the housing, #16, I do believe.
Been a while, and that pic is kind of out of order, but I think that is correct.

I;m not much help here.
 

Having not ever been into one, this is just an observation. Looking at the parts diagram, To me it appears that Snap ring #15 , holds bearing #14 into #16. John and Lew, am I way out in left field?

Yes it does,jon.I guess pics are in order for tomorrow.

Maybe this will help- if I did it right

This is about as clear as pond water to me. Hopefully the photos will help. I'm trying to install #15 Internal Snap Ring - Part #716-04098.

1st image shows #14 bearing (with #8 snap ring installed) on #7 input shaft. Note the groove on the side of the bearing, close to #13 planet gear thrush washer. If #15 is installed in the groove on the bearing, then #16 Bearing Cage will not seat into the #1 housing enough to install #19 Bearing Cage Retainer Snap Ring.

2nd image shows #16 Bearing Cage. Note the groove inside the bearing cage. If #15 is installed in the groove inside the bearing cage, then the same issue as above (#16 Bearing Cage will not seat into the #1 housing enough to install #19 Bearing Cage Retainer Snap Ring). Note the damage to the cage at the 6 o'clock position where it appears someone may have tried to force the cage in with a BFH.

There is normal resistance from #17 O-ring along the outer rim of the bearing cage, getting it past the groove in #1 housing where #19 Snap Ring goes.

The cross section that was posted is how it goes together,is the bearing the correct width?
this one is 7/16 or .4375

Just my 2 cents, but judging from Dart1917's drawing....

there is a snap ring on each side of the bearing, one in the groove on the input shaft, the other in the groove in the bearing cage.

I would make it that way and then try to put the bearing cage into the main housing without the big thrust washer. If it does go in, something on the other side of the thrust washer might not be right. Else wise, that input shaft is not going far enough into whatever it goes into.

:popcorn:

I'm pretty sure your putting it together backwards.

You put the bearing in the #16 housing, install the snap ring to hold the bearing in, then put the shaft through it (but the big washer on the shaft first, and install the snap ring on the shaft. Then you would install the #16 housing into the other housing, then install the seal.



I also agree with Lew, check the bearing width. Although, I would think that if your bearing was too wide, then you wouldn't be able to get the snap ring on the shaft.

Your order of assembly may be holding things up.

The bearing should be installed into the cage first, then #15 snap ring to keep the bearing in the cage.

With no other parts in the main housing and no "O" ring on the cage and no seal in the cage, put the huge washer into the housing, then put the cage in, to see if it fits. if it does, great. If not, you gotta find out why.

Once you get the cage to fit in the housing correctly, put the big "O" ring on it and put it back in and install the big snap ring.

Then #7, #9, #11 and #12 need to be assembled and installed from the other side.

The shaft should then go in far enough to install snap ring #8.

You would not be able to put those parts in from the other side,#9 is held in by a roll pin,how do you install it with the housing on?

It goes together like this.

1 press bearing on shaft,install small snappy ring.
2 install bearing and shaft into housing.
3 install snappy ring in housing.
4 install thrust washer.
5 install planetary gears.
6 install gear # 9 with shoulder facing planetary gears.
7 install roll pin in #9 be sure is flush to the gear .
8 install sliding gear # 10
9 install O ring on bearing housing.
10 install whole assembly into creepy housing.
11 install snappy ring.

Not saying your method is wrong, but if you put #7, #9, #11 and #12 together first (along with the pin that holds #9) then you can slide the whole assembly in and put snap ring #8 on then put the seal in.

For instances like this, where it is difficult to get the cage properly seated into the housing, installing the thrust washer and cage first may make the process easier.

I very much appreciate all the replies in this post. Your (y'alls) expertise is impressive, but your willingness to help is outstanding.

It was a sequencing issue. Followed the (Cub) yellow brick road and it fell into place. Hopefully, now it will stop puking lubricant.

I inherited the CC 128 from my father-in-law who bought it new in 1974. My son and I restored it together, and now i'm hooked.

Thanks everyone! Great to be a Cubber.

More creeper info needed
 

Folks,
(not trying to hijack this thread but it has good info!)
I don't harass you guys much any more but have a general question on these creepers. Yes I have a problem. I have a 102 with a creeper. Loaned it to the grandson and he brought it back with the handle for the creeper removed and said the only way he could get the tractor to move was to hold the creeper lever forward past the normal stop. Well I played with it a little last night and yes something is messed up. When I put the creeper lever back on the tractor it would not move in low or high.
I took the handle extension off again wiggled it forward and back ward some and finally got it to engage in both hi and low.
My gut feel is that this will have to come out and be repaired?
Regards,
Chris

Your gut is probably right Chris.

The yoke where it contacts the shift collar will wear, the pin hole in the yoke and the pin can also wear and the hole in the handle can wear as well.

Some of these points can wear naturally but more often the wear is caused from the lever being forced. It usually takes years of use for this wear to be noticeable from the operators seat.

It has to come out as Yosemite Sam wrote. It may be as simple as worn pins or worn out parts.

I make levers and poppets if you need replacement parts.