The Haunted 129 -_-
 

In 1973, my grandfather purchased brand new his 129. It was his workhorse on his home in Pennsylvania for 15 years. He was a tough old man, WW2 POW (Battle of the Bulge), purple heart recipient, however he was kind to me. He had pictures of me on it with him driving around the yard. After some time something happened with the 129 and he through a tarp over it and purchased a red cub. About 20 years later, I purchased my home in MA and my grandfather decided to give me his old 129. He brought it to his local cub repair shop and had the engine rebuilt and had it purring for me and brought it up to MA for me. I am not very mechanical and I have tried to maintain it while using it as my workhorse. My grandfather has since passed away from Alzheimers. After he passed, I have had issue after issue with the cub. Again, I know, its a 42 year old tractor. But I at this point I can't explain what is going on. Most recently I am getting no crank when I turn the key, just a single click. I have replaced the starter generator, the solenoid, the voltage regulator and the battery. I have wire brushed battery terminals and ground to frame from the battery. I have confirmed that I have voltage to the starter generator when I turn the key. I also confirmed that the new starter generator does spin after disconnecting from the cub and using jumper cables connecting the positive leads. My lights work as well. I've been searching for days now you tube help videos, wiring diagrams and electrical trouble shooting tips to no avail. So I signed up for this page. My wife wants me to get rid of it. She thinks it's cursed. I'm not there yet and don't think I will ever be. Any suggestions?

Welcome to OCC
 

There will very knowledgeable folks along shortly to help you sort this out. You have come to the right place.

How did you check to make sure your getting power to the s/g? The s/g needs both positive and negative to turn so if you really do have positive at the s/g then it must be a ground issue, are you testing with a test light or a volt meter?

ACR not working? If there is a problem with the ACR the S/G may not be able to turn over the motor.

Yes I used a voltage meter. I used the same meter to confirm the solenoid is functioning when I turn the key.

Hi! What is the ACR? I'm sorry, just not super knowledgeable with this stuff.

Yes used the multi-meter and I did use the negative on the separate battery and attached the ground on the starter generator and the hot on the post.

Acr stands for auto compression release, the camshaft has the acr built into it and it makes the engine turn over easier. If you take the belt off the s/g does it spin when you hit the key? If it does you may have an acr issue but if it still doesn't spin then the issue is elsewhere.

Oh thanks! Yes it spins the motor. I left the starter generator pulley attached but disconnected the electrical and then used a battery to jump it. It spun the motor.

Ok then I doubt its the acr. Like I said if you really have positive at the s/g it must be a ground issue, as a quick test to confirm you can hook a jumper cable up to the negative terminal on the batt and hook the other end to the body of the s/g and if it turns when you hit the key then you know you have a ground issue.

I did that too. Unfortunately just a click.

Sounds like a ground issue. Your model has the battery under the seat with a short negative cable attached to the frame. The engine is solid mounted to the frame so the frame is essentially the ground path. When it "clicks", what is your voltage across the battery? Also, what is the voltage at the A terminal of your generator? If both are good, Put a jumper cable on battery negative and the other end on the case of the generator. See if it cranks.

Edit: Tim beat me!

Ok since grounding it didn't help take the jumper cable and hook it to the positive terminal on the batt and touch the other end to the outside terminal on the s/g, if it turns over then there's an issue somewhere between The positive terminal and the s/g.

Your 12v from the ign switch to the solenoid runs through the brake/neutral and pto safety switches which have to be made up to let the solenoid pull in and send power to the starter i believe. You could supply a 12v power source directly to the post on the solenoid that comes from the key/safety switch's and see if that spins it over, if so I believe one of the 2 safety switches may not be letting power flow from the ign switch to the solenoid. I've had ignition switches that where not used for a long time and the internal contacts on the switch where corroded

Be said it clicks so that would lead me to believe he's getting power from the key switch to the solenoid which means the safety switches are working if there is any, alot of older machines have had them bypassed asnthey went bad.

Post a pic of the solenoid. Was it from Cub Cadet? Are you sure it's the correct one? I don't see an answer as to whether you are getting 12V to the starter when you hear this "click". Are you? Did you wire up the new solenoid correctly? My guess is it is either the incorrect solenoid, or it's wired wrong. Some pics would help.

The link below shows a way to start a Kohler engine with the minimum number of wires. Following this procedure will eliminate an engine problem from your troubleshooting efforts. It won't help identify what problem you have in your wiring harness, but will get your engine running.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfuSEie3rHM

I always like to get info off YouTube. :RollEyes2: In that video, we have a guy who is replacing an engine because the old one blows head gaskets and he can't figure out why. Then he shows you how to start it, while using 18 gauge wires. That'a less than half the size they need to be. Although he does have everything hooked up correctly and it did start the motor, the maker of the video is prime reason why I hate the internet and YouTube. Because anyone with a camera can post a vid. The blind leading the people who can't see.

I suggest hanging out here and getting advice from people who actually know how to fix a Cub.

adamo, That's a great story about your Grandfather and his/your 129.

If you get rid of your 129 you will never have another opportunity to pass a family owned Cub Cadet on to your offspring. With a little care and maintenance your 129 could faithfully serve you and your descendants for years to come.

The electrical systems on our old Cubs can be frustrating for someone who is new to them, but don't be discouraged, we were all new to this at one time or another.

Armed with your meter or test light and the wiring diagram that Roland posted (in post #18), choose a time when you can relax and take your time with no interruptions. Starting at the battery (pos to neg) follow the path that the electricity takes through the wiring harness, you will come to a place where the voltage drops or is interrupted.

You may want to bench test your old solenoid just to see if it was part of your original problem. Don't forget that the solenoid needs to be grounded.

Yup, not haunted, just a few gremlins that need to be worked out.:beerchug:

Ok. I checked the voltage at the A terminal starter generator when I turn the key and it is just over 12v. I cleaned the ground at the starter generator. I did put a jumper cable on the bat neg and the other on the generator and it did not crank still. Still just a click. I also attached jumpers from the batt negative terminal to the frame, and then again to the engine block- still just a click.

Through all the chatter in this thread I've lost track of what's been done and not.

In order to find your problem you need to find out where the electricical gets to and where it doesn't.

One prong of your meter on the bat + and the other to a good clean bare spot, not rust, not paint on the S/G, should have 12+v. If you do not have 12+v then you have no ground.

If you have 12+v from the bat + to the S/G, then one prong from your meter to bat- and the other to the hot side of the solenoid. Then to the little wire on the solenoid (with the key turned to the start position). Then just follow the same path that the electricical flows through until you find the dead spot.

If you fart around jumping from one thing to another, you have created nothing more than a guessing game and may never find out where the problem is.

lead from solenoid to starter gen
 

I believe you need to check real well the wire from the solenoid to the starter generator. Based only on what has been said in this thread and what troubleshooting you have done, it sounds as if the system is functioning. I suspect that you have a bad wire or termination on the wire that is carrying voltage but no amperage. Put your red booster cable on the generator side of the solenoid and the other end on the same post of the starter generator, hit the key and see if it will crank.
As J mech said if you could post a picture of the solenoid and how it is wired that would help a lot.

Thank you. I may have found something (not sure however). The little terminal on the solenoid is only getting to 10.8v when I crank it. The solenoid is clicking when I turn the key. Also when I jump the two main posts on the solenoid I still only get the click. I am getting 12v+ everywhere else. Does that mean I have a bad ground at the solenoid even though I have 12v at the two main posts of the solenoid? And if so, how do I better ground a brand new solenoid? It's already mounted directly to the wall.

Ok= will try tomorrow. Will post pic tonight of what I have. Can take more pics tomorrow.

If you jump across the two big posts of the solenoid and get a click, then something is very wrong. The solenoid shouldn't click when those two posts are jumped. Are you sure this clicking noise you hear is coming from the solenoid and not the starter? The motor is free right? You can turn it by hand?


There isn't a simpler starting system in the world than this system. The solenoid is just another switch that lets power go to the starter. Is that "switch" letting 12V go to the starter when you hold the key in the start position, yes or no?

Yes. Same click sound. I think it is the solenoid activating but not positive. Yes I have 12v going to the other post of the solenoid when I turn the key. Also when I jump the small terminal with the battery lead post of the solenoid I get a click as well. The engine is free. I'm positive it is not the starter/gen. When I attach the starter generator to a battery directly ( after disconnecting the A and F terminal leads to the tractor) It turns and spins the motor.

If I did this right here are a couple of photos of the solenoid that some asked me to post. I took these earlier, but I realize that I need to get better pics in the daylight. Other pics I took were too blurry.

JUmped the big post
 

When you said you jumped the big post do you mean from one large post to the other? That should not produce a click. if so you definitely have something wired up incorrectly. What should happen when you jump the big post to one another the starter should turn. I have on occasion had to jump across those two big post with an old screwdriver to get one started and back to the house,
You will have fire fly when you do this however. if it doesn't turn over by doing this then, that should only leave faulty cables, unless your wiring connections are really screwed up.

If you choose to jump the large post, you will want to use an old screw driver. it will burn the tip. And don't use a small wire it will burn you,

Gotchya. No I did not hear a click until I jumped the post with a screw driver and then turned the key. Just touching the two large posts together with the screw driver by itself did not produce a click. I did get a click sound when I jumped (with a screw driver) from the small post to the larger solenoid post connected to the lead from the battery.

jumped with screw driver
 

So your motor did not turn when you jumped the two big post together? you had better check that the wire going to the starter. It is broken or not corrected to the right place.

BTW; When you jump the big post it doesn t matter if the key is on or off as far as the motor turning over. It will not start with the key off but it should still turn over.

I have checked that wire. When I turn the key, I can confirm that I am getting 12v to the A terminal on the starter Generator.

you are getting 12v
 

Okay so you are getting 12v to that terminal when you hit the key to start position.
For now lets disregard that, When you jumped the big post together you should also still get 12v to the Terminal on the starter gen. Now the thing is, one strand of wire in that cable will carry 12v, but that does not mean you are getting enough amperage to spin the starter. If you have a heavy gauge wire available, make up a temporary wire to replace it. That is what I was talking about doing with your booster cable but it may be difficult to get the cables in there.

I really couldn't see how your solenoid is wired. I could not see a wire on the big post that is nearer in the picture.

On a large load like a starter, if only one strand was carrying any voltage, you would read 0 volts at the starter because would consume it.

No way the wire is getting 12V on it. Something is missing


I would like to know that as well. To me, it doesn't look wire correctly.



That solenoid is the wrong one.
Also, right next to the solenoid is the PTO safety switch, which doesn't appear to have anything touching the button, and the wires are connected to the switch. So..... that likely isn't working either. I think the system is wired all wrong.

I have the old (er) solenoid, (pictured) which I can throw back on. I only purchased another to eliminate that possibility. I think the old one must be functional still. As for photos I will get better ones tomorrow and post. As for the PTO switch, it seems that it is in contact with the bar that connects to the PTO arm. I will try to get better pics of that tomorrow as well.

• Even though the battery is new, you might need to charge it back up and have it load tested. The shortcut around that is to try to jump the Cub with a truck or car. It's possible to have faulty batteries right off the shelf.

• The starter/gen may be spinning, but does it have enough UMPH© to actually crank the motor over? I've got 2 starter/gens that really struggle.

I've had tractors go click-click-click and it turned out to be something like loose battery cables or juuust not enough electrical power to get the motor cranked over. Don't let your wife ever talk you into getting rid of your grandfather's Cub. That man walked out of the Ardennes alive, she can put up with a few gremlins!

:beerchug:

:American Flag 1:

New photos.
 

I uploaded more photos. Again, as currently wired, the tractor ran fine 2 weeks ago. However, I'm open to any suggestion. I can tell that the frayed wire coming off the solenoid and back near the voltage regulator is not connected to the voltage regulator. The only available terminal is the L terminal. I disconnected that wire and tried again, still just a click.

Post a pic of you battery.

You do have a 12 v battery, correct?

I do..... :biggrin2: