Converting a 782 to gear drive
 

Is it worth the time and effort to convert a 782 IH cub to gear drive? I hate the hydro for plowing and tilling and that is all I do with it. It is just so jerky to operate that I think a gear drive would be much nicer.

If its worth the time what rear would i use?

Why not just look for a Gear Drive Cub Cadet..??? Cub Cadet did make an 1806 which was a 18HP Gear Drive tractor.

You will lose the hydraulic pump so you'll have to put an external pump on it if you want to keep the hydraulics. I'm with Roland, I'd go buy an older gear drive and be done with it. You could sell the 782 and buy a gear drive and probably have some money to spare.

I asked that very same question not more than two days ago to a friend of mine. Like the previous post says though, you'd be better off just getting a different tractor. By the time you try to find all the parts, the price would be pretty high, unless you found a donor tractor anyway. Also to till with a gear drive, your going to want a creeper gear. That alone will probably cost 200$+. It's your machine and your money, but my opinon would be look for another cub.

I guess i never even thought of loosing the hydraulics, that completely slipped my mind. I will have to just grin and bear it with the 782. I really like the tractor and its built like a tank but about the only thing the hydro would be good for is mowing.

It sounds like there are others that don't really care for the hydro for plowing and such. Is there anyway to tighten up the hydro engagement under load? It seems to not go until the hydro lever is almost wide open then when it takes of it about throws you out of the seat. It does not do this when you are just driving around. The tiller will also push the tractor when tilling so you have to almost put it into reverse to keep it from going too fast. Are these all common problems or is my hydro out of adjustment?

I know somewhere on this site this has probably been covered but i can't figure out the words to search for to get any good search results.:BangPC:

Pull the tunnel cover off and check the reunion, its probably worn out and needs repaired. If you download the service manual it will have the procedure for adjusting the linkage.

I feel your pain, in my opinion tilling with a hydro is a lot of work, but tilling without a hydraulic lift can be a killer.

There are a lot of options to weigh but I built a dedicated tiller tractor a couple of years ago and I've never looked back.

12hp, gear drive, creeper and hydraulic lift, it's like tilling garden while setting in an easy chair.

Just my 2 cents but I prefer tilling my quarry with a hydro. I keep one hand on the control so when I hit rocks (notice I didn't say a rock) I can stop faster. I guess if you have decent soil to work with a gear drive is probably better.

Same here, Sam.

First of course is to confirm working right as Olds suggested. But yes it is possible to "tighten up" the hydro - in a way. If you increase spring pressure or for exteme exampe, disable the spring system (read solid) the hydro will get VERY positive. I don't like excessive speed change on hills. So I do tweak mine a bit. Down side is you learn to respect that handle! Way to easy to get into trouble with yanking it back and forth from a oh sh!@#t moment. But with a little "tuning of the springs it can be tweaked to suite your desires. I suggest starting with a new set of springs as yours might just be tired.

Gear drive>hydro.... Nuff said. :biggrin2:

Thanks for the replies guys. Im going to go through the adjustment procedure and see where that leaves me. Then maybe tweak it a little to make it a little more usable.

I would bet your trunnion is all slopped out if it's as jerky as you are describing. Sounds just like my 149 was when I brought it home. Check it out, look for groves in the corners where the caps are off center. Get it fixed and you'll be surprised at the difference it'll make.

My 782 only tills with a no. 2 tiller and it's amazing. What's up with yours that makes it a burden? I do like plowing w a gear drive better but hydros are fine too. when I'm home I till a lot of friends gardens and it goes through some rocky soil superbly

I've heard it said that if you plow with a creeper you will break it. So what if you are tilling with a creeper that's in a 782 with a 17hp engine. Would the creeper be able to stand up to that level of power?

And dont overlook the maintenance of just changing the filter and hydro fluid. I had one that needed to be pushed all the way forward, then would pause, before it would start moving. Changing the filter and fluid made it back to normal.

And as mentioned here, the trunion (also check for side to side and play in the mechanism).

Then you will know they hydro is running as well as it can.

You don't need a creeper to plow because you need to move faster than that. It would be silly to plow that slow, and it wouldn't work.

I think it's a myth about creepers breaking under load anyway. I'll have one soon and we'll see.

As far as using a creeper while tilling, no you won't hurt it. There is no load pulling a tiller. It pushes you. Have you never ran one?

So one of the 1200’s I have has a creeper, I think you could order a creeper on a 582 that has a 16 hp engine and, Roland you said a 1806 was a 18HP Gear Drive tractor. Could that tractor be ordered with a creeper, or could you add one? What I’m getting at is, is a creeper a creeper a creeper? One unit for all HP engines or are they HP specific. Could I add a K341 in place of my K301 or could IAMBEN add a creeper/transmission/rear end from a 1200 into his 782 and have it survive, the creeper I mean.

Yeah Jonathan, I did use a tiller once, I think,… only a walk behind, and no it did not pull me around, but I think I have a few more pounds on my frame that you, maybe that’s why I always get that job every year, and running the overseeder, and the aerator…and the…

I think that there is some load while running a tiller, on the PTO, churning that tiller through this New England soil, not quite like what we used to have out there in Irving. Hence the desire for some more Horse Power!

So many questions all at the same once...

All of the IH built gear drive tractors were available with a creeper up to and including the 1200. And yes a 582 (and 1806) were also available with a creeper and I believe several if not all of the later gear drives were, although somewhere along the way (after the 82 series I believe) they were changed from cast iron to an aluminum housing other than that the creepers are all the same.

I don't know of anyone who has successfully tilled a garden with a gear drive Cub Cadet that did not have a creeper gear installed. Not saying that it hasn't happened, but I've never seen it NOR have I seen pictures of it. Surprisingly, here in the Midwest a lot of horse power is not really required for using a tiller. My Brother uses a #1 tiller with one extension on a 10 hp 129 and I use a #1 with one extension on a 128 and we both have power to spare. There is a member here from Northeast Indiana who uses a #1 (no extensions) on the back of a 70 and claims that he has no power issues.

One does not use a creeper gear when pulling a moldboard plow.

I personally do not condone pulling heavy loads on a regular basis with a tractor that is equipped with a creeper gear. Please understand that I'm not saying that you will break a creeper every time out, but a creeper is in fact, the weak link in the drive line, weather engaged or not. I see no need to "abuse" a creeper gear who's parts are either terribly expensive or NLA.

I believe that Zippy1 and yeeter are correct, check your trunnion and repair if necessary and you might want to change the fluid and filter, it could very well make a huge difference.

I tell you what though, there ain't nothin as sweet as tillin with a Wide Frame gear drive that has a hydraulic lift. If I just had gps so I could keep my rows straight and know when to turn around...

A 582 can have a creeper, yes. It was an option
The 1806 came factory with one.


What tractor???
Yes, all creepers are the same inside, and the same mounting pattern and can be interchanged. BUT, there were 5 different creepers. Two for NF, a WF, a cast iron for an '82 series and an aluminum for an '82 series. With the exception of the aluminum housing one, the only difference is the handle.


Yes.


A 782 is a hydrostat. No creepers allowed.


You completely miss the boat here. I don't care if you weight 500# or 100#, if you don't hang onto the handles of the tiller, it will take off by itself. I wasn't talking about a walk behind anyway, we are discussing rear tractor mounted tillers.


Yes...... there is load on the engine. Again, not what the discussion is about. We are talking about the drivetrain. When tilling with a tractor the tiller pushes against the drivetrain. You can actually feel all the slack in the gears reverse load as it starts pushing against the engine. The motor is actually holding the tiller back. Unless you are in really soft soil, then you have to pull it, but effort is very, very minimal. You will not damage a creeper with a tiller or a snowblower. Only concern is trying to..... I dunno, pull a house down with 8 wheel weights on each side so you have good traction. More than likely, you'll pop it then. Personally, I don't think with no added weight you could ever load the creeper enough to break it. Others may disagree. (It would also depend on the weight of the operator. All factory test were done assuming a 175# operator IIRC.)

I've tilled a garden or two with my 125 (hydro) and didn't have any unforeseen problems at all. It went quite well actually. Sure there was some control handle jive going on, but it got the job done....
On a side note. Tilling in the swamp last week with the Bota and 55" tiller, it was so wet, that the front wheels of the tractor were almost half underground, and with the tiller all the way down it would push me through. Picked up the tiller and the tractor started spinning the tires, and forward motion nearly stopped.
As mentioned. Hard part is holding back forward motion and getting good penetration of the soil without going to fast.:bigthink:

Thanks Guys.