Front pto not engaging properly
 

I was mowing yesterday and noticed that after cutting 15 feet beautifully, I wasn't cutting anymore. So I investigated and found a stick lodged between the deck and blade. Pulled it out, made sure both blades were spinning by hand and tried again. No dice...belts were moving very slowly. So I adjusted the length of the pto engaging rod (2 threaded rods with thingy in middle). Spun nice and fast for a second then very slowly.

Do you think that I just need to keep adjusting the rod until it's length is perfect? I just want reassurance before I keep messing with it...don't want to damage anything doing something stupid. And excuse my ignorance when it comes to these machines. I do hvac work for a living, so I'm pretty handy. But I've never worked on anything like this and would love to learn.

Now that I'm actually thinking about it, maybe it's as easy as tightening up the belt tension?

Yes, it sounds like a belt tension adjustment is in order and not your front pto. That or you need to buy a new belt, if you smoked the old one.

Cub Cadet 123

Cool. It's raining so I will check it out later today or tomorrow. It "was" a brand new belt before I got a hold of it, but I'm going to order replacement belts all around to keep on hand just in case.

Start with belts, then diagnose PTO.

When engaged the pto throw out arm shouldn't be contacting the pto button at all so it shouldn't matter what the adjustment is on that. Only for shutting the pto off does that matter.

Nice weather today, so I decided to tinker with the 123. PTO not engaging at all. Pulled front off of 123 (what a PITA to get to a couple of the bolts), and this is what I see:

[IMG]http://s6.postimg.org/9imp9f5fx/cc_001_2.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://s6.postimg.org/f82xtqbm5/cc_002.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://s6.postimg.org/7gqt8wwul/cc_004.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://s6.postimg.org/aq58fdky5/cc_003.jpg[/IMG]

One of those three screws was very loose as well.

That top pressure pin doesn't look right, and the thing that depresses the thrust button looks totally worn. Any advice?

thrust button is GONE- you need a new one. It probably wouldn't hurt to pull the PTO and pull it apart to see if anything is worn (like the fiber disk in the center or how the clutch ends look where they meet said PTO.) If everything checks out ok, putting it back together with the template and it should work good. You may end up having to do a rebuild of the PTO.

On my 147 the PO had worn off the thrust button (like yours) so he kept tightening the turnbuckle down to disengage the PTO. He did this to the point that it completely destroyed the throwout levers/fingers, blew apart the fiber disk AND the sealed bearing underneath. So please don't let it go that far.

I'm guessing that there must be damage to the PTO already as is wont even engage. I don't want to get in over my head, but guess I will have to pull the PTO.

Getting to know this machine was my plan for the future, not my plan after getting one mow out of it :)

Pull it off and rebuild it. If you have a screw loose (that sounds wrong) it needs fixin. :biggrin2:

Does someone sell a rebuild kit for the front pto? Or should I pull it, go through everything and order what I need?

Looking at your photos again the spring is bent (that's why the tab on the top of the photo is sticking out) and w/o the spring it won't work properly.

Judging by the type of spring I see you likely need this http://ccspecialties.org/pics/ptokitb.jpg

PN/ IH-543690-R92 Use 759-3490


I found it here: http://ccspecialties.org/ptocreepers.html

the button you need is P/N- IH-473483-R1 (OEM fiber) a lot of people have gone to the bronze ones, but I've never had an issue with the fiber one.


that page has a whole lot of stuff for mechanical PTOs. Good luck.

Thank you for the link drglinski. My jaw puller didn't fit, so I ordered a new one and will pull the PTO when it comes in. I'll post pics because if something isn't obviously broken, I won't know what to make of it.

you dont need a puller to get the pto off, just take out the 6 set screws and it will come right off, if you need a puller then something is wrong.

Three regular set screws spaced 120 deg apart remove them and there is three. Pointed ones under them they are holding on the bearing you can't pull the bearing off couse there is a locking collar

You're already mowing. Wow! We still have 30 degree days and frozen ground. Can't wait to do some mowing with my cubs

Go here.....

http://www.cubcadetman.com/cc/how-to...basket-pulley/

I mowed for the first time yesterday. Needed it on Monday, sorry for the high jack.

Been soaking the allens in kroil for 12 hours. The first one (exterior and interior) came out so easy, but the second two ruined all 4 of the 1/8" allens I had on hand. Of course, both stores I went to didn't have any 1/8 singles in stock. So I ordered 25 from Amazon and will keep soaking in kroil until they come in. I really hope I don't have to drill them out.

Fish around in there w/something sharp. Maybe there is crud etc. stuck in the head, then blow it out good.

I dug around a little with a small piece of copper wire I had laying around, but will get in there better with a small punch or something.

So...as I was riding the 123 back into its cubby, I noticed that the PTO was spinning like a top. Maybe the PO kept tightening the turnbuckle (just like on yours drglinski) to compensate for the missing PTO button and bent the spring in? Or maybe it was getting there, and my monkeying around with it finally did it in?

Was thinking maybe a pick of an awl, something sharp and strong enough to nit just curl up. The extra 1/32" or 1/16 " you might gain jus may do the trick.
Make sure your allen wrenches are fully bottoming is what I mean.

Was thinking maybe a pick of an awl, something sharp and strong enough to nit just curl up. The extra 1/32" or 1/16 " you might gain jus may do the trick.
Make sure your allen wrenches are fully bottoming is what I mean.

At least with the 1st ones out you will have a place for the penetrant to puddle while it does it's thing

Found an old ice pick that I forgot I had and will give that a try.

I bought a set of these last week. Currently $1.99. Disposable at that price. Feel free to abuse.
http://t.harborfreight.com/4-piece-p....google.com%2F

http://www.harborfreight.com/media/c...mage_16048.jpg

Sorry for the huge photo, I couldn't find a smaller one.

Another word of advice is don't use the Allen's that have the ball at the bottom that is supposedly the size. I use a t handle set but ground off the ball portion because they will snap off instantly.

You'll notice that you might be able to break it free easily enough but it will get tighter and bind up on it's way out. Don't just keep spinning it, spin it out a little then back in numerous times when it gets that way. Also agree with what's said before, clean them out as much as you can, good luck

I ordered the rebuild kit and some extra set screws just in case. The PTO runs with the mower belt unattached, but will not turn at all with the belt on. Just wondering if this could indicate what the problem is?

If the springs are weak or if the fiber disk is worn thin it could do that.

SO..... this thread has gone on really long. But doesn't seem to be getting anywhere.

You say that the PTO runs with the belt off in the disengaged position. Well..... that's not really uncommon at all.

When you install the belt you say it doesn't turn. Is that when the PTO is disengaged? Or engaged?

If you put the belt on and it doesn't turn when it's disengaged, but does when it's engaged and doesn't seem to be slipping.... then leave it alone, it's fine. Replace the button on the end of the engagement rod, adjust it and go.

Jeff in PA sells them:
http://www.onlycubcadets.net/forum/s...ad.php?t=20875

I'm sorry...
I just read through this thread again. I missed the pics in post 7. I though they were from someone else. I see now that the OP posted them.

Yes. I completely agree, the PTO is shot. Sorry again that I missed them.

So what all did you order? Please don't say a "kit" because the contents would depend on who you ordered it from.

J-Mech, I ordered a kit! Hehe, I actually ordered the one that drglinski linked me to on page two of this thread. "IH Complete PTO Clutch Re-build Kit - Style B PN/ IH-543690-R92 Use 759-3490 Fits 71 thru 147"

Hopefully that and the new button I ordered will have me sorted out.

If you mean this kit:
http://ccspecialties.org/pics/ptokitb.jpg

No, you didn't get enough parts.

You also need the button (on the PTO), the levers, bolts, a bearing and a button (for the lever).

Yup, the link is a good start, but I agree, more parts are necessary.

Ya, that's the one I ordered. With all of those parts, maybe I would be better off ordering a rebuilt one and sending in mine.

Maybe......

It is difficult to tell without actually having the parts in your hand, but from the pictures it looks to me like the fingers and bolts are fine, the center button is questionable.

From my experience, it looks like someone pulled the lever back too far (pulled it back and hooked it behind the stop tang). The fiber button does need to be replaced but the pto center button only looks like it has "fiber button build up" on it. It doesn't appear to be worn away, it doesn't appear to be galled and it has no nasty grooves.

The chip in the casting at the 2:00 position does concern me a little. It may be possible that the finger where that chip is could turn just a little bit and cause the center button to be just a little bit off center.