Voltage regulator question
 

The VR on my 149 was faulty. I got a new one from Patton Acres, the $60 after-market one. Installed it today. Hooked up a voltmeter to the battery (13.2V) and started the engine. At idle I was reading 14.5V, at WOT 16.8V.
Charge indicator gauge needle slightly on the + side.
I'm concerned that 16.8V is too high. Continued running at high RPM will cause the battery to boil over.
Asking for opinions on this.
Connections made: F wire to F terminal, BAT wire to BAT terminal, GEN wire to GEN terminal on underside of new VR. L terminal not used. Ground wire removed.
Pics of old (L) and new VR (R). Sorry for poor quality.

http://www.onlycubcadets.net/forum/p...pictureid=6109

Make sure that the mounting feet are properly grounded. With a meter, there should be zero ohms resistance between the V/R mounting feet (and or case) and to the battery negative ( - ) terminal.

Just checked; 0.0 ohm on my digital Fluke.

That is too high.

Sounds like it is grounded and wired right.........I think your new V/R is bad.

Thought so. Output from the S/G is the same as I was seeing at the battery; an unregulated charge.
Here's the link to what I bought from Patton Acres.
Unfortunately for me, it's sold 'as is - no warranty'.
http://www.pattonacres.com/cub-cadet...2-123-149-169/

Is it adjustable as the OE ones were? Granted you shouldn't have to right out of the box. Although, you should contact them and just see what they say, he might work with you on it, as long as everything is hooked up exactly right and your positive it's the problem. What was wrong with the old one?

One of the coils was bad. Not charging the battery.

Might Give him a call and nicely explain what is going on, wouldn't hurt anything.
Usually if it is charging like that, the field is fully excited, meaning the field wire is
fully grounded.
If the "F" wire is grounded somewhere other than through the reg. it will charge unregulated, worth a check.
If no luck with a phone call to him, I'd take the cover off carefully and look @ the points to see if visually something is a miss.

George, ohmed ( is that a word?) all the wires yesterday; all good. Plan on looking at the points later today.

FWIW, If you don't know,
In theory,
as the voltage builds the coil gets stronger and pulls the points apart.
fighting the spring(s) --- it is a balance thing,
that is how a mechanical reg works.

Also sometimes the wire terminals are in the same location, but marked different,
so make sure that is correct, many a fellow was fooled by that.
You can actually move the points apart with your fingers and see the amperage vary.
and, is your battery charged up when you checked the voltage?
if it is low, you will see a high voltage/ charge rate, but should not see as high as your reading as posted before by Roland.

Two things to consider...
What is the condition of the battery. It can read good voltage at rest but may have a low charge or internal problem that causes mis-readings. (is that a word?). Could you try a different battery or start the tractor, disconnect the battery and see what voltage you read at the bat + cable.

The other thing is you say "the meter is only showing slightly to the + side". Voltage doesn't fry the battery, too much current does. If something is bad I'm wondering why you are not seeing high current through the ammeter.

Is it possible that the S/G has an internal problem that is causing a constant full charge situation?

Possible yes. Disconnecting the "A" wire at the S/G and running it is the test. With the wire dis-connected it should not charge.



Get another DVOM and check the static charge on the batter. I find it odd that you get a 13.2 reading on it, unless you just pulled it off of a charger. Even a fully charged battery should not read 13v. (Unless it just came off the charger, then it will. But not after sitting for a while.) I'm wondering if you meter is wrong.

yes, just came off charger.

Is there a section in the shop manual on adjusting the regulator??

I don't think so...

This may help........ http://www.simpletractors.com/servic...regulators.htm

Its in this narrow frame manual, starts page 1-31. Does sound like it's full fielded somehow.

http://ccmanuals.info/pdf/1x6-7%20Service%20Manual.pdf

The wire to the f terminal may have a cut in it where it connects to the regulator from rubbing on the frame/fender pan.

Here's the reply I got from Patton Acres in regards to my VR.

voltage regulators are adjustable. they dont come out of the box ready to go .last summer I had the generator rebuilt on my farmall C. At the same time I installed a new wire harness and voltage reg. fired it up and it pegged the meter. I called the shop that rebuilt it and he walked me through adjusting it over the phone. He told me I should have brought it and he could have set it up on the bench with the gen.
Yes there is no warranty on electrical same as if you bought it from your local dealer. I worked in a chev/toyota dealer for 25 years and it was same policy unless we installed it. Thanks for the info ,Rich

Well I wouldn't say they all need to be adjusted. I'm on my fourth tractor, replacing the VR on each and I have yet to have one not work. Maybe I'm just lucky.

Terry

I put it on my other tractor. Different S/G, wiring and battery. Same results. Found some info on adjusting 2 contacts V/R's and that will be next.

Link on how to adjust is in post 17 although it's a little tougher on the wide frames since the battery is in the way

Thanks Alvy, but this VR is a little different internally. The adjustment mechanisms aren't the same.

I've asked Patton Acres for a procedure to adjust it, specific to what they sent me, since their reply was 'all VR's need to be adjusted, they're not set out of the box'. I'll see what happens with that.

No doubt at some point it will work. Not a priority right now.

I've never had to adjust a brand new V/R... EVER. On anything.

I couldn't agree with J mech more!
And I have been working with voltage regulators since the mid 1950's,
A new one out of the box should be left alone, and not adjusted.
Sorry Mr Patton, I don't agree.
I have adjusted a 6 Volt reg. to charge a 8 Volt battery we used to put on ford flat heads, and others, in the day.
And adjusted them when a fellow did all night driving, but not a normal instillation.

Me too, I agree.

Right, wrong or otherwise, I made up an "extension cord" that I use to adjust regulators.

I park the tractor just outside the garage door, take the wires off the regulator, unbolt the regulator, attach the wires on the e-cord to the wires on the tractor, the other ends to the regulator, start the tractor, take the regulator into the garage, close the door and adjust the regulator while setting in a lawn chair inside the garage.

I know that sounds like a lot of extra work, but trying to adjust one with the engine noise and vibration going on, simply makes me nervous enough that I can't get the job done, so this is my alternative and it works very well for me.

Sam, I like the extension cord idea. I'll use it when I get around to working on the tractor again.

Yes indeed, I like it as well. Very loud especially at close to WOT for sure and trying to adjust one with the fine adjustment range with the vibration is a little nerve wracking, good idea Mark

I've always equated trying to adjust a voltage regulator on a Cub to; Trying to remove a splinter from a screaming childs finger with a needle... Much easier to remove the finger first then dig the splinter out.

Although it is a little easier to reattach the voltage regulator than it is a finger.

I manage a parts store, electrical stuff is non-returnable as in no cash refund, however an exchange for another( if faulty) is no problem. Cadet regulator is VR-220 in Standard ignition parts.

Mark:

I like the idea of "remoting" the V/R for testing and adjustment.:ThumbsUp:

If your going to go to all that trouble to remote mount the V/R, why not just set up a "test bench" with a S/G and an electric motor? Then just take the V/R off and hook it up to the test bench and set it up. 3600 RPM 2HP electric motor, basket pulley, belt and a S/G..... a couple wires... :bigthink::bigthink:

You could even use the test bench to test S/G's. :bigeyes:

it is more fun the udder way, engine running and shaking...just takes up more room.

Here is a link to the v/r....

http://www.ruiter.ca/mc/info/PDFs/1R-116.pdf

In all actuality, it is such a ridiculously stupid thing, I really am a little embarrassed about it. Although, I'm not exactly sure why.

All in due time...

Just got done doing the same thing.
 

I had the S/G rebuilt on my 70, and when I started it, the digital meter showed 15.6v. I like to see 13.8-14v with my tractors. That seems to work well without any battery issues.

Some regulators have a screw inside that allows you to adjust that spring. Others simply bend a tab to give the spring less/more tension on the points. Shouldn't be too terribly difficult to do. The one on my 70 has a screw for the field coil points and for the cut-out points. Our Originals require the spring tab to be bent accordingly.

Is the voltage regulator up by the headlights on a 149 like it is on my 70? I used a needle-nose pliers to adjust the spring tension while someone else held the meter on the battery terminal and "A" stud on the S/G.

No, it's under the seat next to the battery.

Ah! Thanks. Wasn't sure, but I am sure that makes it a bit more difficult to access and work on.