questions for the pros
 

Hey all, I'm not "IN THE CLUB" yet but considering it. A little background as quick as I can. My Dad has a John Deere 140 with a blade and tiller. He also has a 317 with a blower and cab on it (it does have an after market Power steering added). He's headed for retirement so I had mentioned to him to pick me up a JD at some point and fix it up for me and I would pay him (Because I know he'll be bored out of his pumpkin sooner than later so I thought it would be a project). At a recent auction about a month ago he found a newer JD-LA110. Came with a blower, bagger, weights and a soft enclosure for under $1700. I have been reading about the hydro having problems on these machines after while so I have been starting to think about selling it already and getting something older and more reliable.

I am a fan of Green but don't like to parting with mine. It seems like these old cubs are a little more reasonable and I'm sure just as reliable as the JD stuff. All of this is leading up to my question. On craigslist in my area there's one that appears to be in decent shape.

Does the following seem to be a good deal if it runs well? It's been on line for a while which makes me think he might be about 250 too high or people don't know the steal they are missing out on. the other day someone had a 1650 for $500....looked nice. Anyhow, let me know what you think of this.....

Cub Cadet 1450 for $1300 -- also included are the following: Service Manual which covers full tear down and rebuild of the tractor and the implements on CD, 1-48" Mowing Deck with extra set of blades, 1- 42" Snow Blower, 1- 42" Push Blade, 1- 42" Rotory Cultivator.

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k2...5/CubCadet.jpg[/IMG]


What are the big differences in the 1450 Vs the 1650? Is motor size it? What about hydraulics? Can I use the same accessories on both tractors? Also, is there an add on power steering kit for these old tractors? I have found the thing about the new bushings and all to make steering easier but nothing about power. Anything else I should know about?

There's also one with a bad motor (1450) and a tiller for $300. Thoughts on getting that and modernizing the motor?

My Mechanical ability is Tinker/Parts swapper. I do have a lot of great tools that I can kind of make work (Torch, welder, sockets) so I have most of what I need to really dive into something...just not the most experience (I should have payed more attention when dad was fixing stuff). My easy option would be to hold onto the box store one I have and wonder when it's going to give up the ghost. 2nd easiest is get GREEN because I can ask dad questions or I can be different.

Thanks for reading.
Randy in Iowa

Randy :Welcome2:

The 1450 has a 14HP and the 1650 has 16Hp motor. Other then that they are the same. The tractor pictured does not have the side panels. They improve cooling and should be on there IMHO. I have a 1650 and love it. On any QL tractor (800, 1000, 1200, 1250, 1450 and 1650) you should check the ISo mounts on them before you buy. The same pictured tractor has non stock headlights. The stock headlights are round. In the list of items you list a 1- 42" Rotory Cultivator it makes me wonder if you mean tiller. The 1450 with engine problems can be rebuilt and no need to put a modern motor in it. Expect to pay $500+ for a rebuild using Kohler parts. These engines are worth rebuilding. They are work horses.

Thanks
 

Methos, thanks for the info. I have been trolling for a short while here and didn't even pick up on the round/Square headlights. That thing about the rotary cultivator I'm assuming is a tiller. I copied and pasted the add so that's what it said. I need to get down to look at it.

I guess the main question, for all the accessories and the tractor does that seem to be in a reasonable ball park price wise?

I really just want something heavy duty so If I want to drag something around the yard it's not going to be a problem and tear the tractor up.

P.S. - Sorry if I posted in the wrong section on the forums.

It took me untill last saturday to see why a IH Cub Cadet are above JD. 97 percent of pullers have a gear IH Cub Cadet. Nice IH Cub Cadet man!

Randy no worries on posting in the wrong section of the site.

I think price wise he's a little high. I also do think he means tiller due to the tiller gear box on the back. If the ISO mounts are bad expect to pay in the $80 range for new ISO mounts from cub.

I think you'll be happy the way the cub is able to pull things. As John said the pullers love these cubs and will buy a cub and paint it other tractor colors and that says a lot of the cubs. I don't have anything bad to say about JD or any other brand but I do not regret buying a cub.

The price depends on the condition of all the attachments and the condition of the tractor.

The attachments would be around $500 - $700 range , but that does depend on the condiiton of them. Might be cheaper than $500 if they are questionable condition. Check the tines on the tiller and slop in the tine shaft, and it would be a plus if he has the long , EXPENSIVE belt that runs the tiller gearbox.

Same for the blower. Chain and sprocket wear , bearing noise , etc.

Just a thought , the blower,tiller,and blade are heavy and bulky , so if you think you will not need them , don't buy them. OR buy and resell if not needed.

Looks like that would be a $400/$500 tractor/deck in my area , if the side panels are there. But that does depend on condition. I would expect to do some maintanence on the tractor. They are tough and easy to work on , but most people are careless about maintanence.

If it was me , i would start at $900 for everything , but 1,000 may be the max for me.

Just my .02 cents. Hope it works out for ya !!

Good points Darrel! I paid $52 for my tiller belt for my 1650. The NF tiller belts are the pricey ones. I paid $110 for my tiller belt for my son's 125.

Just looking over your pics, the seller says that it has a 48" deck, he is wrong, it looks to be a 44" but could be the 50", but I am pretty sure it is the 44". You can tell by the not discharge end of the deck, it is rounded off, the 48" would be squared off, and looks to have the one piece deck belt cover, again the 48" would have 2 piece deck covers. If the tractor runs and starts well, and all the accessories work (pto, lights, etc) as the should, I would say it is a $350-500 tractor. If the seller doesn't have the side panels, you might as well figure they are going to costs you around $100 to get some shipped to you. As mentioned, the isomounts need to be checked, if they are bad that is another expense.
However, I can see what appears to be 2 link chains on the rear tires, that ought to be worth $50, and the tractor has the sleeve hitch installed, good for another $100+. The rear tiller if it is functional should be good for another $200-300, I think it mentioned snow blower to, that should be worth $200-300 also.
So doing my math, the tractor with side panels, no repairs needed let's say $650 (figuring in the sleeve hitch and chains), add the tiller and snow blower would on the low end put the low end for the package, would put you at $1150, high end price would be $1350, so his asking price is not that far out of line. If you go try it out and like it, I would offer him $900 to start out with, you can always increase your offer if it something you want.
Oh, by the way, it has hydraulic lift for the attachments, I think you asked about this too, but am not sure anyone confirmed that it did.

I am posting from my iPhone so forgive the typos. I see you were wondering about power steering also, it can be added by mixing and matching some parts from the super garden tractors, but I don't think the effort or expense would be worth it. Adding the steering upgrade (search the site you'll be able to find it) makes the steering effort much easier and only sets you back around $20, besides, they don't steer very hard anyways.

ok, here's where I'm at. (for all I know he's reading this giggling right now). Anyhow I Emailed him and he's pretty firm on the price at $1300 which is probably why it hasn't sold yet. He says firm but if I show up with a pocket full of money that may change.
It's Vintage 1974 (So at least I'm older than the machine ... barely). Engine is the 14hp Kohler K321 engine, he's put new points, condenser, coil, and plug. He must have maintained yards with it (other than his) and that's why the lights are square...he put in 50w Halogen instead of the factory 20w. Motor has never been torn into that he knows of...unsure of hours or how long he has owned it. He did say it's the 50 inch deck and everything should work. Doesn't smoke or use oil and he does have the side pannels for it, I have no idea why they aren't on.

Here are some pictures of the implements to go with it...and good news, he does have the belt for the tiller.

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k2...th_Img0382.jpg

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k2...th_Img0383.jpg

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k2...th_Img0384.jpg

Thanks for all the input.....it's like the little devil child and it keeps calling my name. Meanwhile the nice little angel is sitting on my piggy bank telling me to save my money......:BB&YS:

Sorry photos are so big. At least this way you get a good close up look! I see it looks like there's been some welding on the blower but it's 37+ Years old....

Showing up with $900 cash couldn't hurt! seems to change peoples minds. Would take more just in case.

Randy, I agree with Duke, Darrell, and Jeff. I'd start at $900, but if everything is in good shape $1300 is about right. Like Jeff said, $200 is the low end for a good tiller and a good snowblower. You can find mower decks on Ebay for $375. That doesn't mean someone's paying that, but sellers are trying to get that. The deck looks like it's in pretty good shape in the pics. So $500 for the tractor with deck, $250 for the tiller, $250 for the snowblower, and $125-$150 for the blade puts you at $1150. I agree that when the seller sees a handful of cash he'll want to work with you.

I met a puller a couple of weeks ago who pulls with a cub cadet 124. No modifications other than the bars to keep it from flipping over. He blew me away when he told me it has the original clutch on it! Just a testament to how tough cubs are.

It'd be pretty rare to find an old QL with good ISO mounts, as far as I've seen. Almost no one ever replaces them, except for guys that really know and care for their Cubs.

The 1450 I bought, the PO spent $550 this spring on new stuff, including the front flange, new flex discs, etc...but the ISO's were left shot to heck.

And to your query about why he'd take those side panels off - most guys think it'll help their engine cool better, but on the contrary, IH designed them for optimal cooling with the panels on.

There are other cubs out there if you don't obtain this one and there are more attachments out there as well. It depends what you want to do with it right now. If you plan on putting all of those attachments to good use right away and do not want to go on a scavenger hunt at times, then see if you can acquire them for around $1000-$1100. If you want a cub for just one specific task, then you can save some $$ and find one similar to that for about $300-$400 or so, (at least in my area.....sometimes the price changes based on location, and of course the connections you have). You can always acquire the attachments later on and as you need them or want them. Sometimes, you might have to walk away from it and realize that the deal just wasn't meant to work out and that there are other cubs out there. I see a lot of cubs from your state on E-bay for reasonable prices and it might not hurt to keep your eyes open for confederate yellow (or if you're luck a red one) on your next drive through the countryside....who knows what you might come across!!!

Welcome to the sight and hopefully you will join our "Cub Club" soon!!!

Cub Cadet 123

the question to ask yourself is what do you want to do with the cub? Do you need a tiller, snow plow and snow thrower?

I know you could get a similar IH tractor that runs with a mower deck for about 1/3 of this guy's asking price. Do some maintenance for it and then pick up a plow or snow thrower if you even need them. I don't see the point in getting redundant implements like a snow plow and snow blower, you'll just have to sell some of them or trip over them in the garage.

Thanks
 

Thanks for all the suggestions guys. As for what accessories I need. Snowblower is #1, the tiller would be ok. I have a small garden and it would be overkill but if I had this I would get rid of my walk behind tiller so that would be alright. The blade would be the least needed of the bunch but if I ended up getting the "FEVER" you all describe I'm sure another one could end up in my garage and as someone said why change attachments when you can just change tractors. Time is usually pretty tight between the random hours of work, my wifes activities and chasing my 8 year old around for sports and scouts. I guess it would be nice to just get everything at once and clean it up and be ready to use it although I would be missing out on the "THRILL OF THE CHASE". If I do it I"m sure you'll see a lot more of me on here. Thanks again for everyones time and suggestions.

Randy

Randy thanks for the updates. If your like me once you have a bigger tiller you'll have a bigger garden! If you like it and can afford it the price isn't to out of range. I don't see him dropping down to $900 maybe $1150 but don't see him going any lower. But to help you get a better price check out my pics in my 1200 thread. There you'll be able to see what the clutch looks like when the ISO mounts are worn out. Unlike my pics the 3 pin drive should have equal pin showing thru the friction disc. There are also pics of my rear ISO mounts. You can clearly see that they are well worn out. If the ISO mounts are worn out use that to get a lower price.

http://www.onlycubcadets.net/forum/s...7&postcount=25

Some tips to help you out when you go look at it. Your going to go look at I'm sure of it! Check the oil level and make sure it's at the top full line. If the oil level is low it makes to engine smoke less. Look at the 3 pin drive on the clutch and make sure it doesn't look like mine! It will be hard to see the ISO mounts but the clutch will show miss alginment if they are worn. Once it starts up feel the tunnel cover for vibration. There should be very little. If the ISO mounts are badly worn the engine will rattle in the cradle when you increase the idle.

Keep us up to date!

Looks like the snowblower is complete , but do check for bent augers , sprocket,chain,bearing wear on this. Looks like it is 42" also ?? Unless he hooks it to the tractor , you won't hear any funny noises until you hook it up. The snowblowers take a beating sometimes , the snow has everything covered and you can't see whats in there.

Looks like the tiller is complete as well. Check the tines out , and check out everything else listed above. Oh , and if it is a #2 tiller and you want to sell it and you are not to far from where i live in MO. , i would be interested !!

The blade frame has had some reinforcing done to it , which never hurts. They have been the easiest attachment for me to find. I think i have five or six of them. People get tired of them being in the way.

If you are like most of us , you will want a tractor for every attachment , if you have the room and funds. Makes life alot easier , but obviously you will spend more on maitenance.. If you do not buy other tractors , go to HF and buy two of their furniture dollys for the tiller and blower , maybe the blade also. They are having a tent sale this weekend and they are like ten bucks apiece.

Cubs are everywhere in my area , and i bet they are in your area also. The attachments seem to be harder for me to find than the tractors. But you do have to keep an eye on CL and try to beat all the other tractor guys there !!

Hope this helps , because now my two fingers hurt !!!!!!!

Darrell

Duke, he might have a hard time looking for the 3 pin driver on the clutch since the one he is looking at is a hydro. :0)

AJ

AJ that's what I get for having mostly gear drives!:bash2:

I don't think this is the first instance you weren't paying attention to what you were reading...LOL!!!!!!!!!:HeeHee::HeeHee:

Jeff :Spank: